福特准备离开欧洲,关闭嘉年华和福克斯生产线,并准备将工厂卖给比亚迪(上篇)
2023-02-02 用功 13330
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The Dual Transition
When I was young in the UK, Ford was huge in the British market (as was also Honda!). Has shrunk a lot and the Puma, Kuga and Fiesta were #4, #9 and #10 in the UK in 2022. Honda has already gone to all intents and purposes, looks like Ford is going the same way. Shrinking back to the US may work for a short while, but its competitors will come for it there as well. Great if BYD gets a factory in Germany, should scare the hell out of VW.

当我还年轻的时候,福特在英国占据了巨大的市场(本田也是如此)。在2022年,它们缩水了很多,Puma、Kuga和嘉年华(Fiesta)在英国的排名是第4、第9和第10。本田已经从英国撤离了,看起来福特也在走同样的路。缩回美国可能会在短期内奏效,但它在美国的竞争对手也会和它抢夺市场。如果比亚迪能在德国建厂,那就太好了,应该能吓死大众。

Howard
British car buyers and workers have been buying Ford cars in huge numbers for decades , far more than other European countries. We were rewarded by Ford moving factories to cheap Eu countries . Now they are pulling out of Europe. Karma .

几十年来,英国购车者和工人,一直在大量购买福特汽车,远远超过其他欧洲国家。我们得到的回报却是福特将工厂迁往廉价的欧盟国家。现在他们又在撤出欧洲,真是报应啊。
原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Van Rozay
I'd say Ford has learned the lesson, a bit late, but well enough to know it has to downsize, to lean and mean, to have a chance to survive. Bye, bye, dealers. All in on EVs. Probably the smartest way to stay in the game.

我想说,福特已经吸取了教训,虽然有点晚,但它已经足够清楚,它必须裁员,精简和吝啬,才能有机会生存下去。再见了,再见了,经销商们。全面专注于电动汽车,这可能是留在这行最聪明的办法。

wayne johnson
From the UK, I can report around my area, number of EVs and especially Teslas have gone up this month. On my regular walks, a few extra every week

我来自英国,我可以报道,在我所在的地区,电动汽车的数量,尤其是特斯拉的数量,本月有所上升。来自我定期散步,每周几次的观察。

John Lozauskas
You hit the nail on the head. There has never been a higher need than for an all electric fiesta or Honda Fit. 90% of the people can not afford cars over $45k US without a 10 installment plan or leasing.

你说到点子上了。没有比全电嘉年华(fiesta)或本田飞度(Fit)更大的需求了。90%的人如果没有分期付款计划或租赁,根本买不起超过4.5万美元的汽车。

Be Low Below
Hopefully BYD could build their affordable EVs there

希望比亚迪能在欧洲生产出价格合理的电动汽车

Mika Filtenborg
I think Tesla will make a 24,000 $ carmodel in year 2025....

我认为特斯拉将在2025年推出2,4000美元的车型....

Steven Jones
@Mika Filtenborg
Not in Europe at that price.

在欧洲,这个价格是不可能的。

ambessa shield
It would no longer be affordable if it's built in Europe. Low wages in Asia is the reason why they're cheaper.

如果在欧洲建造,人们将买不起。亚洲的低工资是它们更便宜的原因。

Be Low Below
@ambessa shield
that part is true, but so is the fact that Chinese automakers have been investing early in EV R&D and production supplies. They'd still be cheaper, but that's imo

(亚洲的低工资是它们更便宜的原因)这是事实,但中国汽车制造商很早就在电动汽车研发和生产供应等方面进行了投资,这也是事实。(即使在欧洲建造)它们仍然会更便宜,这就是我的看法。

silvergreylion
@ambessa shield
Have you seen how automated those factories are? - the number of workers is fairly low.
I don't know how many man-hours are needed per vehicle, but they'd have to be affordable, otherwise BYD wouldn't be buying the factory to produce their EVs there.

你看到那些工厂的自动化程度了吗?工人的数量相当少。
我不知道每辆车需要多少工时,但比亚迪负担得起,否则比亚迪就不会在欧洲收购工厂,在那里生产电动汽车了。

Andrew Kaiser
@ambessa shield
But they might increase automation even more, to the point that they can still get the price lower. I only thinking maybe on this. I'm not really predicting it.
We'll see.

但比亚迪可能会更多地提高自动化程度,以至仍然可以把价格降低。我只是在想也许会这样,并不是严肃的预测。
让我们拭目以待吧。

Nio62
Agreed.

同意你的观点

Android One
They definitely need to have the atto 1 ( seagull), atto 2 (dolphin) and the atto 3 assembled in europe. That way they wouldn't be slapped witha mega import tax bill.

比亚迪肯定需要atto 1(海鸥),atto 2(海豚)和atto 3在欧洲组装。这样他们就不会被征收巨额进口税了。

billdale1
That's silly. The reason BYD builds such cheap cars is that they are being built in CHINA, with CHEAP CHINESE LABOR. If they build then in Europe, they'll be built with more expensive European workers, and the price advantage disappears.

这是很愚蠢的。比亚迪之所以能生产如此廉价的汽车,是因为它们是在中国生产的,使用的是廉价的中国劳动力。如果他们在欧洲建造,他们将使用昂贵的欧洲工人,价格优势就会消失。

justlikedog
​@billdale1
cheap labour is not the important reason. In fact, there are two reasons why Chinese evs are extremely cheap. The first is that BYD has the vertical industrial chain, which means they have the ability to reduce its cost, and the second is there are a great many of factories of all kinds in China, which means you can buy assembly parts in a way cheaper price. For example, if you set up a factory in England, then you have to buy assembly parts from China, since you can not buy them in local, and obviously it is more expensive.
not a native speaker but hope you can understand it. Reduction of cost is not an easy thing, it is time to think in a mature way

廉价劳动力不是重要原因。事实上,中国电动汽车如此便宜有两个原因。第一,比亚迪有垂直产业链,这意味着他们有能力降低成本,第二,中国有很多各种各样的工厂,这意味着你可以以更便宜的价格购买组装部件。例如,如果你在英国建厂,那么你必须从中国购买组装部件,因为你在当地买不到,而且显然更贵。
我的母语不是英语,希望你能听懂。降低成本不是一件容易的事,是时候成熟思考了。

Thyme Capsule
build them in czech republic then the wages are small here

在捷克共和国建造吧,这里的工资很低。

Eish
@billdale1
BYD would have to simply sell European built cars at higher prices in order to make it feasible to assemble there. In other markets it can sell at lower prices china made cars.

为了使在欧洲组装成为可能,比亚迪将不得不以更高的价格销售欧洲制造的汽车。
在其他市场,比亚迪可以以更低的价格出售中国制造的汽车。

Ric Nyc
Recently Ford closed 2 factories in Brazil. One of them is being sold to BYD too.

最近福特关闭了在巴西的两家工厂,其中一家也是卖给了比亚迪。

Bob Cornwell
Actually, the main cost difference between making a large vehicle and a small one mostly use of more materials. The number of parts, which have to be made an later installed, is about the same. And materials cost, although quite respectable, is a mere fraction of the total cost. So a large vehicle, that sells for maybe double of what a smaller one sells for, may cost maybe 50% more to build. The other 50% more of the price difference becomes profit.

实际上,制造大型汽车和小型汽车的主要成本差异在于使用更多的材料。在以后的安装过程中,需要制作的部件数量是差不多的。材料成本虽然相当可观,但只占总成本的一小部分。因此,一辆大型汽车的售价可能是小型汽车的两倍,但制造成本可能只高出50%。多出来的50%的价差全是利润。

Mika Davies
Wow!! All the talk about EV's whilst really they were shrinking and pulling out of Europe. Good luck to BYD.

哇!!都在讨论电动汽车,实际上福特正在萎缩并退出欧洲。祝比亚迪好运。

isak sidenius
Lets see if they actually buy it.

让我们看看比亚迪是否真的会购买福特的工厂。

Sabret00th Sabret00th
No mercy for any legacy manufacturer CEO. This situation could clearly be seen a decade ago.

形势对任何传统汽车制造商的CEO都不会留情面。这种情况在十年前就可以清楚地预料到了。
原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Dan Carter
Was part of the original Ford Focus launch team spent a lot time at the Saarlouis plant during that launch. A little sad to hear it is being sold, but better sold than left to rot.

我曾经是福特福克斯最初创建团队中的一员,在当时成立期间,我在萨尔路易斯工厂呆了很长时间。现在听说它要被卖掉,我有点伤心,但卖掉总比任其腐烂好。

For The Love Of Noise
Yea, sad to say, a lot of the 4 bangers from Ford are not built so good. The thing about America manufacturers is their 4 cylinder engines always get the least love and are usually the least reliable, while their V8s are more reliable... and the V6s are somewhere in the middle (unless you count the V6 in the early 2000s Buick LeSabre, that is one of the most reliable V6 engines ever made by a U.S. brand...but it's in a very boring car and it's automatic only)

是的,很遗憾地说,很多来自福特的4 banger都不是那么好。美国制造商的问题是,他们的4缸发动机总是最不受欢迎,而且通常最不可靠,而他们的v8发动机更可靠……而V6则介于两者之间(除非你算上21世纪初别克LeSabre的V6发动机,这是美国品牌有史以来最可靠的V6发动机之一……但这是在一辆很无趣的车里,而且只有自动挡的。)

Captpicard
Hi Sam
I live in London in the UK. The Ford plant in Dagenham closed about ( years ago, it has since been sold off and the factory which used to produce the Fiesta, then it just produced engines has now been completely demolished and a new housing estate of over 2,500 apartments and houses has now been built on the land. 2 Ford dealers where I live in East London have also shut that had been around for years. Ford in the UK are dying I see it happening with every passing month, never mind year by year.

嗨,山姆
我住在英国伦敦。福特在达格纳姆的工厂大约在几年前就关闭了,它已经被出售了,曾经生产嘉年华的工厂,当时只是生产发动机,现在已经完全被拆除了,一个超过2500套公寓和房屋的新住宅区,现在已经在那片土地上建立起来了。我所在地,东伦敦的两家经营多年的福特经销商,也已经关闭了。英国的福特汽车正在消亡,每个月都在发生,更不用说年复一年了。

Edward Gilmartin
So BYD will convert factory to EV production and Ford couldn't do that itself?

所以比亚迪会将工厂转化为生产电动汽车,而福特自己却做不到?

Steven Jones
Germany is too expensive to produce small, low profit margin vehicles.

在德国生产低利润的小型汽车,成本太高。

Mika Filtenborg
@Steven Jones
so why do VW produce VW e-Up!? ??

那为什么大众要生产“VW e-Up” !?(译者注:VW e-Up是大众生产的一款小型电动车)

Danial Moser
They could, if they had a car worth producing for European buyers.

如果大众有一款值得被欧洲买家购买的汽车,他们就可以生产。

Larry Evans
@Steven Jones
The way traditional companies build in Germany is too expensive. And many are resisting changing that (see what happened to Deiss). But Germany is also looking at a population cliff and labor shortage in the next few years, and the shift to a focus on increased productivity will happen. Look up population pyramid for reference. With greater process efficiency and automation, the location of the factory makes less of a difference. It can even be cheaper if it is closer to materials and consumers.

传统企业在德国的建造方式过于昂贵。许多人拒绝改变这一点(看看戴斯的遭遇)。但在未来几年,德国也将面临人口悬崖和劳动力短缺,会将重心转向提高劳动生产率。我查阅了人口金字塔以供参考。随着过程效率的提升,和自动化程度的提高,工厂的位置所造成的差异,将越来越小。如果能离原材料或消费者更近,甚至可以更便宜。

John Dunkley
One of your other videos said that BYD sell their models in China because the profit was better as there are no shipping costs to worry about. So then, they buy factories cheap and set up production in that local area. Good strategy.

你的另一个视频里说,比亚迪在中国销售他们的车型利润更好,因为不用担心运输成本。因此,他们以低廉的价格收购工厂,并在当地进行生产,确实是个好策略。

Mark Stephens
Sam, that may be a good idea for 4 to sell their vehicles in North America. As you said in the broadcast Ford should concentrate on their strengths not their weaknesses.

山姆,也许福特把他们的车卖到北美去,会是个好主意。正如你在广播中所说的,福特应该专注于他们的优势,而不是弱势。

Andrew Saint
I remember in the 70's and 80's Ford had unx trouble in the UK (everyone did. It's why there's no indigenous car industry anymore. Well, that and nationalisation).
One time they were trying to change something and they made the unx go to Detroit to negotiate. Classy move, had - "we don't need you" written all over it.
You knew then, that the writing was on the wall for this "British" brand.

我记得在70年代和80年代,福特在英国遇到了工会的麻烦(每家公司都是这样。这就是为什么没有本土汽车工业了。嗯,国有企业也是如此)。
有一次,福特试图改变一些事情,他们让工会去底特律谈判。很有格调,底特律到处写着“我们不需要你”。
那时你就知道,这个“英国”品牌的厄运已经来临。(译者注:福特是美国品牌)
原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


zofe
GM has lost Europe - too.

通用汽车也失去了欧洲市场。

DanRyzESPUK
In 2017 they left Europe.

通用汽车早在2017年就离开了欧洲。
(译者注:通用汽车在欧洲经营了近90年后,于2017年宣布退出欧洲市场,因为连续多年亏损)

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