网友讨论：巴基斯坦人是否觉得他们与阿拉伯人、中国人和土耳其人的共同点比与印度人更多？
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Taha Khan, Pakistani
Let us put some things in perspective first. I am going to repeat what i have said before on other threads. There is no one Pakistan just like there is no one india. Pakistanis from eastern side of river indus i,e. Punjabis and Sindhis are technically Indians, They even look similar, sharing same genes, cuisine and culture. They have nothing to do with central asians or middle easterners.
However there is a Pakistan west of Indus river which is as big as the one on eastern side. It includes Baluchistan which has more in common with Iran and Afghanistan than India, 'culturally' and genetically. Same goes for KPK and northern Pakistan. Pushtoons share strong genetic and cultural overlap with Afghanistan. You will notice they have their distinct facial features from desi people.
我们首先要正确看待一些事情，我将重复我以前在其它主题上说过的话：
并不存在一个一体的巴基斯坦，正如不存在一个一体的印度一样。
来自印度河东岸的巴基斯坦人，即旁遮普人和信德人严格意义上来说印度人，他们甚至看起来很相似，有着相同的基因、饮食和文化，他们与中亚人或中东人毫无关系。
然而，在印度河以西还有另外一个巴基斯坦，它和东边的巴基斯坦一样大，它包括了俾路支省，在 "文化 "和基因方面，俾路支省与伊朗、阿富汗的共同点多于印度，开伯尔-普什图省和巴基斯坦北部也是如此，普什图人与阿富汗有着强烈的遗传和文化重合，你会发现他们有与“德西人”截然不同的面部特征。
（ Desi “德西”有时被用作一个标识性的术语，用来指代南亚血统的人，或者可以追溯到印度次大陆的人，它的确切含义和含意因人而异，有些人把它当作一种积极的自我标识符，而另一些人则认为它太局限或甚至是贬低。）
Let us put some things in perspective first. I am going to repeat what i have said before on other threads. There is no one Pakistan just like there is no one india. Pakistanis from eastern side of river indus i,e. Punjabis and Sindhis are technically Indians, They even look similar, sharing same genes, cuisine and culture. They have nothing to do with central asians or middle easterners.
However there is a Pakistan west of Indus river which is as big as the one on eastern side. It includes Baluchistan which has more in common with Iran and Afghanistan than India, 'culturally' and genetically. Same goes for KPK and northern Pakistan. Pushtoons share strong genetic and cultural overlap with Afghanistan. You will notice they have their distinct facial features from desi people.
我们首先要正确看待一些事情，我将重复我以前在其它主题上说过的话：
并不存在一个一体的巴基斯坦，正如不存在一个一体的印度一样。
来自印度河东岸的巴基斯坦人，即旁遮普人和信德人严格意义上来说印度人，他们甚至看起来很相似，有着相同的基因、饮食和文化，他们与中亚人或中东人毫无关系。
然而，在印度河以西还有另外一个巴基斯坦，它和东边的巴基斯坦一样大，它包括了俾路支省，在 "文化 "和基因方面，俾路支省与伊朗、阿富汗的共同点多于印度，开伯尔-普什图省和巴基斯坦北部也是如此，普什图人与阿富汗有着强烈的遗传和文化重合，你会发现他们有与“德西人”截然不同的面部特征。
（ Desi “德西”有时被用作一个标识性的术语，用来指代南亚血统的人，或者可以追溯到印度次大陆的人，它的确切含义和含意因人而异，有些人把它当作一种积极的自我标识符，而另一些人则认为它太局限或甚至是贬低。）
Same goes for Indians as well. It is melting pot of cultures. Northern India is different from southern and eastern India. In a nutshell Eastern Pakistanis have more in common with north Indians then they have with Western Pakistanis both culturally and genetically, let alone Arabs, Chinese and Turks.
Having said that, I have a request for eastern Pakistanis that while giving answers about Pakistan on such topics don't reduce it down to Sindh and Punjab while completely ignoring your western compatriots. Otherwise a pashtun/Northener or Baluch reading your answers will fail to identify with the Pakistan you are talking about. Because factually it doesn't give accurate picture. Some sub nationalists from western Pakistan already call Pakistan, Punjabistan.
Even as western pakistanis we have nothing but love and good wishes for people of India.
印度人也是如此，印度是一个文化的大熔炉，印度北部与印度南部和东部截然不同。
总而言之，东巴基斯坦人与北印度人相比，在文化和基因上与西巴基斯坦人有更多的共同点，更不用说阿拉伯人、中国人和土耳其人。
话虽如此，我还是希望巴基斯坦东部的人们，在回答有关巴基斯坦的这类问题时，不要把它简化为信德省和旁遮普省，而完全忽视你们的西部同胞，否则，一个普什图人/北方人或俾路支人在阅读你的答案时将无法认同你所谈论的巴基斯坦，因为从事实来看，这并不能反映准确的情况，一些来自巴基斯坦西部的泛民族主义者已经在将巴基斯坦称为“旁遮普斯坦。
即使作为西巴基斯坦人，我们对印度人民也唯有爱和祝福。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Having said that, I have a request for eastern Pakistanis that while giving answers about Pakistan on such topics don't reduce it down to Sindh and Punjab while completely ignoring your western compatriots. Otherwise a pashtun/Northener or Baluch reading your answers will fail to identify with the Pakistan you are talking about. Because factually it doesn't give accurate picture. Some sub nationalists from western Pakistan already call Pakistan, Punjabistan.
Even as western pakistanis we have nothing but love and good wishes for people of India.
印度人也是如此，印度是一个文化的大熔炉，印度北部与印度南部和东部截然不同。
总而言之，东巴基斯坦人与北印度人相比，在文化和基因上与西巴基斯坦人有更多的共同点，更不用说阿拉伯人、中国人和土耳其人。
话虽如此，我还是希望巴基斯坦东部的人们，在回答有关巴基斯坦的这类问题时，不要把它简化为信德省和旁遮普省，而完全忽视你们的西部同胞，否则，一个普什图人/北方人或俾路支人在阅读你的答案时将无法认同你所谈论的巴基斯坦，因为从事实来看，这并不能反映准确的情况，一些来自巴基斯坦西部的泛民族主义者已经在将巴基斯坦称为“旁遮普斯坦。
即使作为西巴基斯坦人，我们对印度人民也唯有爱和祝福。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
NoorJahan Khan, Pakistani
This question has three parts which are.
Religion Yes we are close to Arabs and Turkish people never heard any Pakistani saying we are close to Chinese people lol.
Physical Appearance, Culture and language. Now to all those people who are saying Pakistanis are same as indians are wrong. Punjabis are same but Pakistan is not all about Punjab. I am not saying indians are inferior or anything or there is anything wrong in being an indian but the fact is Pakistan is not a small country or Pakistan is not all about Punjab and Sindh. There is a whole new side of Pakistan when you cross Indus river. Ethnicities like Pathans, Balochs, hazaras, tajik, turkish and Kalash people make 60 percent of the population of Pakistan which has NOTHING to do with Indians i mean there cuisine, culture language are all different. They are more similar to central asian people.
这个问题需从三个部分来回答，分别是：
# 宗教
是的，我们与阿拉伯人和土库曼人关系相近，但从未听过任何巴基斯坦人说我们与中国人关系相近，笑。
# 外貌、文化和语言
所有那些说巴基斯坦人和印度人一样的人都是错误的，或者旁遮普人也是一样的，巴基斯坦并不全是旁遮普。
我不是说印度人低人一等，或者做一个印度人有什么不对，但事实是巴基斯坦不是一个小国家，巴基斯坦也不是只有旁遮普省和信德省，当你越过印度河时，会看到巴基斯坦有一个全新的侧面，像帕坦人、俾路支人、哈扎拉人、塔吉克人、土耳其人和卡拉什人这样的民族占巴基斯坦人口的60%，他们与印度人没有任何关系，我的意思是，他们的饮食、文化语言都不同，他们更类似于中亚人。
This question has three parts which are.
Religion Yes we are close to Arabs and Turkish people never heard any Pakistani saying we are close to Chinese people lol.
Physical Appearance, Culture and language. Now to all those people who are saying Pakistanis are same as indians are wrong. Punjabis are same but Pakistan is not all about Punjab. I am not saying indians are inferior or anything or there is anything wrong in being an indian but the fact is Pakistan is not a small country or Pakistan is not all about Punjab and Sindh. There is a whole new side of Pakistan when you cross Indus river. Ethnicities like Pathans, Balochs, hazaras, tajik, turkish and Kalash people make 60 percent of the population of Pakistan which has NOTHING to do with Indians i mean there cuisine, culture language are all different. They are more similar to central asian people.
这个问题需从三个部分来回答，分别是：
# 宗教
是的，我们与阿拉伯人和土库曼人关系相近，但从未听过任何巴基斯坦人说我们与中国人关系相近，笑。
# 外貌、文化和语言
所有那些说巴基斯坦人和印度人一样的人都是错误的，或者旁遮普人也是一样的，巴基斯坦并不全是旁遮普。
我不是说印度人低人一等，或者做一个印度人有什么不对，但事实是巴基斯坦不是一个小国家，巴基斯坦也不是只有旁遮普省和信德省，当你越过印度河时，会看到巴基斯坦有一个全新的侧面，像帕坦人、俾路支人、哈扎拉人、塔吉克人、土耳其人和卡拉什人这样的民族占巴基斯坦人口的60%，他们与印度人没有任何关系，我的意思是，他们的饮食、文化语言都不同，他们更类似于中亚人。
Muslim Factor. Now if you don't know about islam then for your information in Islam there is no concept of race or ethnicity. If you are a muslim you are a muslim thats it. So when we read our history books it say muslims ruled xyz land, muslims did this muslims did that so in that case we feel proud that muslims has a glorious past and we connect with them.
Let me tell you a story when Pakistan did the nuclear tests in 1998 me and my parents were in baghdad. My dad was there for some business meeting. As we were there for two weeks we got around our neighbourhood people welcomed us when they knew that we are from Pakistan. So as the tests news break out people started to gather around our house and saying Allah o Akbar and congratulating us , distributing sweets because Pakistan was the first Muslim state to become a nuclear power and all of them were saying WE(Muslims) became nuclear power there was no Pakistani or Iraqi thing involved. They were connecting with us because we both are muslims.
I hope my answer will help you to clear the air of confusion.
# 穆斯林因素
如果你不了解伊斯兰教，那么我必须告诉你，在伊斯兰教中没有种族或民族的概念，如果你是一个穆斯林，那你就是一个穆斯林，仅此而已，因此，当我们读历史书的时候，说穆斯林统治了某某土地，穆斯林做了这个，穆斯林做了那个，这种情况下，我们会感到自豪，因为穆斯林有一个光荣的过去，我们与他们联系在一起。
让我告诉你一个故事，1998年巴基斯坦进行核试验时，我和我的父母都在巴格达，我父亲在那里参加一些商务会议，由于我们在那里呆了两个星期，我们在附近转了一圈，当人们知道我们来自巴基斯坦时，他们都很欢迎我们，当核试验消息传出后，人们开始聚集在我们的住所周围，说阿拉阿克巴，祝贺我们，分发糖果，因为巴基斯坦是第一个成为有核国家的穆斯林国家，他们都在说我们（穆斯林）成为了有核国家，这与巴基斯坦或伊拉克无关，他们与我们的联系在于我们都是穆斯林。
希望我的回答能帮助你消除困惑。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Let me tell you a story when Pakistan did the nuclear tests in 1998 me and my parents were in baghdad. My dad was there for some business meeting. As we were there for two weeks we got around our neighbourhood people welcomed us when they knew that we are from Pakistan. So as the tests news break out people started to gather around our house and saying Allah o Akbar and congratulating us , distributing sweets because Pakistan was the first Muslim state to become a nuclear power and all of them were saying WE(Muslims) became nuclear power there was no Pakistani or Iraqi thing involved. They were connecting with us because we both are muslims.
I hope my answer will help you to clear the air of confusion.
# 穆斯林因素
如果你不了解伊斯兰教，那么我必须告诉你，在伊斯兰教中没有种族或民族的概念，如果你是一个穆斯林，那你就是一个穆斯林，仅此而已，因此，当我们读历史书的时候，说穆斯林统治了某某土地，穆斯林做了这个，穆斯林做了那个，这种情况下，我们会感到自豪，因为穆斯林有一个光荣的过去，我们与他们联系在一起。
让我告诉你一个故事，1998年巴基斯坦进行核试验时，我和我的父母都在巴格达，我父亲在那里参加一些商务会议，由于我们在那里呆了两个星期，我们在附近转了一圈，当人们知道我们来自巴基斯坦时，他们都很欢迎我们，当核试验消息传出后，人们开始聚集在我们的住所周围，说阿拉阿克巴，祝贺我们，分发糖果，因为巴基斯坦是第一个成为有核国家的穆斯林国家，他们都在说我们（穆斯林）成为了有核国家，这与巴基斯坦或伊拉克无关，他们与我们的联系在于我们都是穆斯林。
希望我的回答能帮助你消除困惑。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Faisal Qureishi, Wrote honor's paper on Moorish Spanish archaeology
We’re part of the Indian subcontinent. Of course we have more in common with Indians than Arabs, Turks and whoever. China is an ally, its never been viewed as culturally kith and kin. Arabs will tell you they have nothing in common with us lolol.
Turkey is a very close ally since independence/partition and there’s that old saying about “two countries one nation” but when you get down to it, absolutely not, a super popular Turkish series notwithstanding, though of course many middle class Pakistani homes were watching Turkish dramas before Ertugrul this year, going back to early 2010s (man I was about to say this decade - has time gone that fast?)
But culturally, historically, linguistically, geographically even religiously (in terms of the post-47 Muslims) the answer is self-evident.
That said, South Asia is a huge diverse place. Not everyone is the same from region to region or interchangeable. Different parts of South Asia have different ethnic groups. The northwest part of South Asia (Pakistan) is the same as northwest post-Partition India and to a large extent North India in general, but less so with Bengal/Assam (East Pakistan notwithstanding) and certainly not with central and south India, Nepal or Sri Lanka.
As for the Iranic groups west of the Indus river, yes they’re very different but some things to keep in mind:
我们是印度次大陆的一部分，我们与印度人的共同点自然比阿拉伯人、土耳其人多，中国是我们的盟友，但它从未被视为文化上的亲属，阿拉伯人会告诉你他们和我们没有任何共同点。
土耳其自巴基斯坦独立/分治以来就是一个非常亲密的盟友，有句老话说 "两个国家一个民族"，但当你仔细想想，绝对不是，尽管土耳其电视剧超级受欢迎，在《埃尔祖鲁姆》（土耳其东部一城市名）之前，许多巴基斯坦中产阶级家庭都在看土耳其剧，时间可以追溯到2010年代初。
但在文化上、历史上、语言上、地理上甚至宗教上（就47年以后的穆斯林而言），答案是不言自明的，也就是说，南亚是一个庞大的、多元化的地方，不是每个地区都是一样的，也不是可以互换的，南亚的不同地区有不同的种族群体，南亚的西北部（巴基斯坦）与分治后的印度西北部以及在很大程度上的整个北印度是一样的，但与孟加拉/阿萨姆（东巴基斯坦除外）就不一样了，当然也与印度中部和南部、尼泊尔或斯里兰卡不一样。
至于印度河以西的伊朗人群体，是的，他们非常不同，但有些事情要记住：
We’re part of the Indian subcontinent. Of course we have more in common with Indians than Arabs, Turks and whoever. China is an ally, its never been viewed as culturally kith and kin. Arabs will tell you they have nothing in common with us lolol.
Turkey is a very close ally since independence/partition and there’s that old saying about “two countries one nation” but when you get down to it, absolutely not, a super popular Turkish series notwithstanding, though of course many middle class Pakistani homes were watching Turkish dramas before Ertugrul this year, going back to early 2010s (man I was about to say this decade - has time gone that fast?)
But culturally, historically, linguistically, geographically even religiously (in terms of the post-47 Muslims) the answer is self-evident.
That said, South Asia is a huge diverse place. Not everyone is the same from region to region or interchangeable. Different parts of South Asia have different ethnic groups. The northwest part of South Asia (Pakistan) is the same as northwest post-Partition India and to a large extent North India in general, but less so with Bengal/Assam (East Pakistan notwithstanding) and certainly not with central and south India, Nepal or Sri Lanka.
As for the Iranic groups west of the Indus river, yes they’re very different but some things to keep in mind:
我们是印度次大陆的一部分，我们与印度人的共同点自然比阿拉伯人、土耳其人多，中国是我们的盟友，但它从未被视为文化上的亲属，阿拉伯人会告诉你他们和我们没有任何共同点。
土耳其自巴基斯坦独立/分治以来就是一个非常亲密的盟友，有句老话说 "两个国家一个民族"，但当你仔细想想，绝对不是，尽管土耳其电视剧超级受欢迎，在《埃尔祖鲁姆》（土耳其东部一城市名）之前，许多巴基斯坦中产阶级家庭都在看土耳其剧，时间可以追溯到2010年代初。
但在文化上、历史上、语言上、地理上甚至宗教上（就47年以后的穆斯林而言），答案是不言自明的，也就是说，南亚是一个庞大的、多元化的地方，不是每个地区都是一样的，也不是可以互换的，南亚的不同地区有不同的种族群体，南亚的西北部（巴基斯坦）与分治后的印度西北部以及在很大程度上的整个北印度是一样的，但与孟加拉/阿萨姆（东巴基斯坦除外）就不一样了，当然也与印度中部和南部、尼泊尔或斯里兰卡不一样。
至于印度河以西的伊朗人群体，是的，他们非常不同，但有些事情要记住：
1.) They’re only 20–24% of the population. Less than a quarter of the population, nowhere near half of the population and certainly not the majority;
2.) Pashtuns are obviously Iranic but in terms of history and to some extent even culture, they’re a transitional people between Indic and Iranic worlds. Pashtuns living in KP live in an area which was historically Indic (Gandhara) and only moved there relatively recently (14th-15th centuries) and absorbed Indic peoples into their ranks. A few Pashtun tribes even adopted Indic Hindko language as their native tongue while maintaining tribal identity, those in easter KP-NW Punjab like the Tareen and Niazi. Imran Khan and Ayub Khan both come from Indicized Pashtun tribes. But even most who retained their Pashtun language and culture were influenced by Indic culture. So they’re kind of Indic by association, even though obviously not anthropologically so. Much like the Tibetans who are Sinitic yet due to living in areas in the subcontinental fringe like Ladakh, Nepal, Sikkim and Bhutan, can be considered Indic by association. Whereas Pashtuns in tribal areas and Baluchistan are more traditional and Iranic Central Asian historically in terms of culture but even they have become influenced by Indic culture through absorbing the national North Indian Urdu Islamic culture of Pakistan, with their own flavor of course.
1. 他们只占总人口的20-24% ，不到总人口的四分之一，远远不到总人口的一半，显然也不是主体 ;
2. 普什图人很明显是伊朗人，但从历史看，在某种程度上说他们是印度和伊朗世界之间的过渡民族，生活在开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省的普什图人所居住的地区在历史上是印度人(犍陀罗) ，他们只是在相对较近的时期(14-15世纪)才搬到那里，并将印度人纳入他们的队伍，一些普什图族部落甚至采用印度印地语作为他们的母语，同时保持部落身份，伊姆兰·汗和阿尤布·汗都来自印度化的普什图部落，但即使是大多数保留普什图语和文化的人也受到了印度文化的影响，所以他们在某种程度上是印度人，尽管从人类学的角度来看显然不是这样，就像生活在拉达克、尼泊尔、锡金和不丹等次大陆边缘地区的中国人一样，他们也可以被联想为是印度人。
然而，部落地区和俾路支省的普什图人则更为传统，在文化方面更接近伊朗化的中亚，但即使是他们也已经通过吸收巴基斯坦北印度乌尔都族的伊斯兰文化而受到印度文化的影响，当然他们也有自己的独特之处。
2.) Pashtuns are obviously Iranic but in terms of history and to some extent even culture, they’re a transitional people between Indic and Iranic worlds. Pashtuns living in KP live in an area which was historically Indic (Gandhara) and only moved there relatively recently (14th-15th centuries) and absorbed Indic peoples into their ranks. A few Pashtun tribes even adopted Indic Hindko language as their native tongue while maintaining tribal identity, those in easter KP-NW Punjab like the Tareen and Niazi. Imran Khan and Ayub Khan both come from Indicized Pashtun tribes. But even most who retained their Pashtun language and culture were influenced by Indic culture. So they’re kind of Indic by association, even though obviously not anthropologically so. Much like the Tibetans who are Sinitic yet due to living in areas in the subcontinental fringe like Ladakh, Nepal, Sikkim and Bhutan, can be considered Indic by association. Whereas Pashtuns in tribal areas and Baluchistan are more traditional and Iranic Central Asian historically in terms of culture but even they have become influenced by Indic culture through absorbing the national North Indian Urdu Islamic culture of Pakistan, with their own flavor of course.
1. 他们只占总人口的20-24% ，不到总人口的四分之一，远远不到总人口的一半，显然也不是主体 ;
2. 普什图人很明显是伊朗人，但从历史看，在某种程度上说他们是印度和伊朗世界之间的过渡民族，生活在开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省的普什图人所居住的地区在历史上是印度人(犍陀罗) ，他们只是在相对较近的时期(14-15世纪)才搬到那里，并将印度人纳入他们的队伍，一些普什图族部落甚至采用印度印地语作为他们的母语，同时保持部落身份，伊姆兰·汗和阿尤布·汗都来自印度化的普什图部落，但即使是大多数保留普什图语和文化的人也受到了印度文化的影响，所以他们在某种程度上是印度人，尽管从人类学的角度来看显然不是这样，就像生活在拉达克、尼泊尔、锡金和不丹等次大陆边缘地区的中国人一样，他们也可以被联想为是印度人。
然而，部落地区和俾路支省的普什图人则更为传统，在文化方面更接近伊朗化的中亚，但即使是他们也已经通过吸收巴基斯坦北印度乌尔都族的伊斯兰文化而受到印度文化的影响，当然他们也有自己的独特之处。
3.) Baluch are only 2–3% of Pakistan’s population despite having the largest province. Plus many Baluch settled in Punjab and Sindhi where they became part of local culture. But that hardly cancels out Pakistan’s Indic identity. After all, India has plenty of non-Indic elements, especially in its northeast. Though distinctive aspects of Baluch culture, like their dishes, have become popular in Pakistan.
4.) I know patriotic Pakistanis will brag about the Iranic Pakistanis as signs of their difference from India. But as far as the actual Iranic-speaking Pakistanis are concerned, Pashtuns and Baluch have always had a somewhat complex relationship with the rest of Pakistan. Perceiving their ethnic and linguistic differences from the majority of Pakistanis, many Pashtuns and Baluch have no problem looking down on them they way they do with other Indic peoples from the plains and they often derisively refer to the rest of Pakistan as “Hindustan”. Baluch especially do this (from my experience) as historically Baluchistan was always more part of Iranian empires whereas the KP and northern Baluchistan areas were often as much part of Indic polities as Iranic ones. That said, of course they mostly support being part of Pakistan and wouldn’t secede despite the wishes of some anti-Pakistan types, but its not like they view their Iranic identity as a sign of Pakistan’s Iranicness but rather as a sign of their own distinctiveness and difference from the Pakistani mainstream - which they see as Indic Muslim, even if they have some Indic lixs themselves.
3. 俾路支虽然是巴基斯坦最大的省份，但人口只占巴基斯坦人口的2-3%，此外，许多俾路支人定居在旁遮普邦和信德邦，在那里他们成为当地文化的一部分，但这并不能抵消巴基斯坦的印度人身份，毕竟，印度有大量的非印度元素，尤其是在其东北部，尽管俾路支文化独特，就像他们的菜肴一样，已经在巴基斯坦流行起来。
4. 我知道爱国的巴基斯坦人会鼓吹伊朗化巴基斯坦人与印度人是不同的，但是就说伊朗语的巴基斯坦人而言，普什图人和俾路支人与巴基斯坦其他地区的关系总是有些复杂，许多普什图人和俾路支人认为他们在种族和语言上与大多数巴基斯坦人不同，因此他们可以像对待平原上的其他印度人一样轻视他们，而且他们经常嘲笑地称巴基斯坦其他地方为”印度斯坦”，俾路支尤其如此 (根据我的经验) ，因为历史上俾路支一直是伊朗帝国的一部分，而开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省和俾路支北部地区往往是印度和泛伊朗化政治的一部分，当然，他们大多支持成为巴基斯坦的一部分，尽管一些反巴基斯坦的人希望独立，但这并不是说他们将自己的伊朗身份视为巴基斯坦的伊朗化特征，而是将其视为自己与巴基斯坦主流不同的标志——他们将巴基斯坦主流视为印度穆斯林，尽管他们自己也与印度有一些联系。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
4.) I know patriotic Pakistanis will brag about the Iranic Pakistanis as signs of their difference from India. But as far as the actual Iranic-speaking Pakistanis are concerned, Pashtuns and Baluch have always had a somewhat complex relationship with the rest of Pakistan. Perceiving their ethnic and linguistic differences from the majority of Pakistanis, many Pashtuns and Baluch have no problem looking down on them they way they do with other Indic peoples from the plains and they often derisively refer to the rest of Pakistan as “Hindustan”. Baluch especially do this (from my experience) as historically Baluchistan was always more part of Iranian empires whereas the KP and northern Baluchistan areas were often as much part of Indic polities as Iranic ones. That said, of course they mostly support being part of Pakistan and wouldn’t secede despite the wishes of some anti-Pakistan types, but its not like they view their Iranic identity as a sign of Pakistan’s Iranicness but rather as a sign of their own distinctiveness and difference from the Pakistani mainstream - which they see as Indic Muslim, even if they have some Indic lixs themselves.
3. 俾路支虽然是巴基斯坦最大的省份，但人口只占巴基斯坦人口的2-3%，此外，许多俾路支人定居在旁遮普邦和信德邦，在那里他们成为当地文化的一部分，但这并不能抵消巴基斯坦的印度人身份，毕竟，印度有大量的非印度元素，尤其是在其东北部，尽管俾路支文化独特，就像他们的菜肴一样，已经在巴基斯坦流行起来。
4. 我知道爱国的巴基斯坦人会鼓吹伊朗化巴基斯坦人与印度人是不同的，但是就说伊朗语的巴基斯坦人而言，普什图人和俾路支人与巴基斯坦其他地区的关系总是有些复杂，许多普什图人和俾路支人认为他们在种族和语言上与大多数巴基斯坦人不同，因此他们可以像对待平原上的其他印度人一样轻视他们，而且他们经常嘲笑地称巴基斯坦其他地方为”印度斯坦”，俾路支尤其如此 (根据我的经验) ，因为历史上俾路支一直是伊朗帝国的一部分，而开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省和俾路支北部地区往往是印度和泛伊朗化政治的一部分，当然，他们大多支持成为巴基斯坦的一部分，尽管一些反巴基斯坦的人希望独立，但这并不是说他们将自己的伊朗身份视为巴基斯坦的伊朗化特征，而是将其视为自己与巴基斯坦主流不同的标志——他们将巴基斯坦主流视为印度穆斯林，尽管他们自己也与印度有一些联系。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
5.) As noted earlier, the lands on which these people live are historically transition areas between the Indic and Iranic worlds. Gandhara was Buddhist Indic with Achaemenid Persian influence, with Gandhari Sanskrit and Prakrit being written in the Achaemenian Kharosthi scxt and borrowing from their architecture and ideas of statecraft. The Arthashastra, the classic Mauryan Sanskrit political treatise, was written by the Brahmin scholar Chanukya in Achaemenid influenced Taxila and certainly reflects the influence of Persian ideas of statecraft. Mauryan architecture, including the famous pillars. show strong Persian influence and most certainly were first made in northwestern India where the Persians ruled. Baluchistan is more solidly Iranian in its history (it was almost always part of Iranian polities except for brief periods of Mauryan and Mughal rule, until the British Raj conquered it), and the people speak a west Iranic language too, making them closely related to Persians, Luris and especially Kurds as opposed to Pashtuns who are more distantly related as Eastern Iranics, most of whose kinsmen were absorbed into the Persian Tajiks except for fringe groups in the Sino-ex-Soviet frontier and Caucasus. Pashtuns being the last major East Iranic group.. But even there you have signs of influence and overlap with South Asia, not least in the form of the Brahui population of Dravidian origins assimilated to an Iranian millieu. The Phenotypes of Baluchistan are also different with many looking no different from central Indians, especially along the coast while other Baloch have more solid Iranian/Persian features. Also the origins of Dravidian civilization began there in Mehrgarh which most certainly is the fore runner of IVC. Plus there’s the Baluch overlap with Punjab and Sindh as mentioned above and a sizable Hindu community lives in Baluchistan with a major Hindu shrine located deep in the province. So again, like KP, Baluchistan can be seen as a kind of land bridge between South Asia and the Iranian world.
5. 如前所述，这些人居住的土地在历史上是印度和伊朗世界的过渡地区，犍陀罗是受阿契美尼德波斯影响的佛教印度人，犍陀罗的梵文和普拉克里特文是用阿契美尼德的佉卢文书写的，并借鉴了他们的建筑和治国思想，婆罗门学者考底利耶在受阿契美尼德影响的塔克西拉写下了经典的莫孔雀王朝政治论著《政事论》（Arthashastra），这无疑反映了波斯人治国思想的影响。
孔雀帝国时代的建筑，包括其著名的柱式建筑，都显示出强烈的波斯影响，而且很可能是在波斯人统治的印度西北部首次建造的，俾路支斯坦在历史上更多地是伊朗人（除了短暂的孔雀帝国和莫卧儿人统治时期，它几乎一直是伊朗政治的一部分，直到英国统治征服它），人们也讲西伊朗语，这使他们与波斯人、卢里斯人，特别是库尔德人关系密切，而普什图人则作为东伊朗人关系更远，除了中国-前苏联边境和高加索地区的边缘群体，他们的大多数亲缘群体都被吸收到波斯化塔吉克人中，普什图人是东伊朗人的最后一个主要群体，但即使在那里，你也会看到南亚的影响和重叠的迹象，尤其是源自达罗毗荼的布拉辉人，被伊朗人所同化。
俾路支斯坦人的外表特征也是不同的，许多人看起来与中部印度人无异，尤其是在沿海地区，但其他地区的俾路支人则具有更多的伊朗/波斯特征，另外，达罗毗荼文明的起源也始于那里的梅尔加，它无疑是印度河文明的先驱。
此外，如上所述，俾路支人与旁遮普省和信德省有重叠，而且俾路支省有一个相当大的印度教社区，在该省深处有一个主要的印度教圣地，因此，和开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省一样，俾路支省也可以被看作是南亚和伊朗世界之间的一座陆地桥梁。
5. 如前所述，这些人居住的土地在历史上是印度和伊朗世界的过渡地区，犍陀罗是受阿契美尼德波斯影响的佛教印度人，犍陀罗的梵文和普拉克里特文是用阿契美尼德的佉卢文书写的，并借鉴了他们的建筑和治国思想，婆罗门学者考底利耶在受阿契美尼德影响的塔克西拉写下了经典的莫孔雀王朝政治论著《政事论》（Arthashastra），这无疑反映了波斯人治国思想的影响。
孔雀帝国时代的建筑，包括其著名的柱式建筑，都显示出强烈的波斯影响，而且很可能是在波斯人统治的印度西北部首次建造的，俾路支斯坦在历史上更多地是伊朗人（除了短暂的孔雀帝国和莫卧儿人统治时期，它几乎一直是伊朗政治的一部分，直到英国统治征服它），人们也讲西伊朗语，这使他们与波斯人、卢里斯人，特别是库尔德人关系密切，而普什图人则作为东伊朗人关系更远，除了中国-前苏联边境和高加索地区的边缘群体，他们的大多数亲缘群体都被吸收到波斯化塔吉克人中，普什图人是东伊朗人的最后一个主要群体，但即使在那里，你也会看到南亚的影响和重叠的迹象，尤其是源自达罗毗荼的布拉辉人，被伊朗人所同化。
俾路支斯坦人的外表特征也是不同的，许多人看起来与中部印度人无异，尤其是在沿海地区，但其他地区的俾路支人则具有更多的伊朗/波斯特征，另外，达罗毗荼文明的起源也始于那里的梅尔加，它无疑是印度河文明的先驱。
此外，如上所述，俾路支人与旁遮普省和信德省有重叠，而且俾路支省有一个相当大的印度教社区，在该省深处有一个主要的印度教圣地，因此，和开伯尔-普赫图赫瓦省一样，俾路支省也可以被看作是南亚和伊朗世界之间的一座陆地桥梁。
6.) Having an Iranic minority doesn’t make Pakistan less Indic any moree than having a large Turkic and Mongolic minority makes China less Sinitic.
Overall I’d say we Pakistanis are a distinctive Indic country, shaped by our history as the frontier of the subcontinent, subjected to various invasions, migrations, and influences from various cultures as well as shaped profoundly by Islam. As such, we have our distinctive version of Desiness. A distinctivenes shared with East Punjab, Rajasthan and Gujarat which are part of our overall subregion, but not with other parts of the subcontinent. Doesn’t make us less connected to them. But the subcontinent (India-Pakistan-Bangladesh-Sri Lanka-Nepal-Bhutan) has many different distinctive regions. We are just one of them. We are many different yet connected peoples sharing a region, we are not just one people, Hindu nationalist fantasies notwithstanding.
6. 拥有伊朗化少数民族并不意味着巴基斯坦就不是印度族裔，就像拥有大量突厥、蒙古人少数民族并不意味着中国就不是汉民族裔一样。
总的来说，我认为我们巴基斯坦人是一个独特的印度语族国家，我们作为次大陆的边疆，受到各种入侵、移民和各种文化的影响，并被伊斯兰教深深地塑造，因此，我们有自己独特的 "特性"，我们与东旁遮普省、拉贾斯坦邦和古吉拉特邦共享这一特性，它们是我们整个次区域的一部分，但与次大陆的其他地区又不一样，这并不意味着我们与他们的联系有减少，次大陆（印度-巴基斯坦-孟加拉国-斯里兰卡-尼泊尔-不丹）有许多不同的特色地区，我们只是其中之一，我们是一个有着许多不同但又相互联系的民族，共享一个地区，我们不只是单纯一个民族，尽管某些印度教民族主义是这么幻想的。
Overall I’d say we Pakistanis are a distinctive Indic country, shaped by our history as the frontier of the subcontinent, subjected to various invasions, migrations, and influences from various cultures as well as shaped profoundly by Islam. As such, we have our distinctive version of Desiness. A distinctivenes shared with East Punjab, Rajasthan and Gujarat which are part of our overall subregion, but not with other parts of the subcontinent. Doesn’t make us less connected to them. But the subcontinent (India-Pakistan-Bangladesh-Sri Lanka-Nepal-Bhutan) has many different distinctive regions. We are just one of them. We are many different yet connected peoples sharing a region, we are not just one people, Hindu nationalist fantasies notwithstanding.
6. 拥有伊朗化少数民族并不意味着巴基斯坦就不是印度族裔，就像拥有大量突厥、蒙古人少数民族并不意味着中国就不是汉民族裔一样。
总的来说，我认为我们巴基斯坦人是一个独特的印度语族国家，我们作为次大陆的边疆，受到各种入侵、移民和各种文化的影响，并被伊斯兰教深深地塑造，因此，我们有自己独特的 "特性"，我们与东旁遮普省、拉贾斯坦邦和古吉拉特邦共享这一特性，它们是我们整个次区域的一部分，但与次大陆的其他地区又不一样，这并不意味着我们与他们的联系有减少，次大陆（印度-巴基斯坦-孟加拉国-斯里兰卡-尼泊尔-不丹）有许多不同的特色地区，我们只是其中之一，我们是一个有着许多不同但又相互联系的民族，共享一个地区，我们不只是单纯一个民族，尽管某些印度教民族主义是这么幻想的。
Jazib Babar, just another Pakistani
You are talking about The Two Nation Theory
which formed the basis of separation of Pakistan from India. Yes, many Pakistanis do feel that they have more in common with Arabs and Turks (chinese? where did this come from? let's assume you didn't mention it) but not everyone holds the same view.
This feeling is unequivocally motivated by the religion. For most Pakistanis, religion trumps everything else. Be it culture, history, language or ethnicity. That's why they feel that they're more related to Arabs and Turks. And they need to keep feeling this way, otherwise it would be too difficult to justify the establishment of a separate country, it would all be for nothing if we reject the two nation theory.
Now since you asked for personal views of Quorans, and I being a Pakistani Quoran, don't feel that we have more in common with Turks and Arabs as compared to Indians. We have an indian descent and share a lot with them. There is no harm in accepting this fact.
你（题主）说的是两个民族论。
这是巴基斯坦脱离印度的基础，是的，许多巴基斯坦人确实认为他们与阿拉伯人和土耳其人有更多的共同点(中国人？这说法哪来的？我们先假设你没有提到它 )， 但不是每个人都持有相同的观点。
这种感觉无疑是由宗教所激发的，对于大多数巴基斯坦人来说，宗教胜过一切，无论是文化、历史、语言还是种族，这就是为什么他们觉得自己更像阿拉伯人和土耳其人，他们需要维系这种感觉，否则就很难证明建立一个独立的国家是正当的，如果我们拒绝两个民族论，那么一切都是徒劳的。
现在，既然你问我个人观点，而我是一个巴基斯坦人，那么我的回答是，我不觉得相比印度人，我们和土耳其人和阿拉伯人有更多的共同点，我们有印度血统，和他们有很多共同点，接受这一事实并无害处。
You are talking about The Two Nation Theory
which formed the basis of separation of Pakistan from India. Yes, many Pakistanis do feel that they have more in common with Arabs and Turks (chinese? where did this come from? let's assume you didn't mention it) but not everyone holds the same view.
This feeling is unequivocally motivated by the religion. For most Pakistanis, religion trumps everything else. Be it culture, history, language or ethnicity. That's why they feel that they're more related to Arabs and Turks. And they need to keep feeling this way, otherwise it would be too difficult to justify the establishment of a separate country, it would all be for nothing if we reject the two nation theory.
Now since you asked for personal views of Quorans, and I being a Pakistani Quoran, don't feel that we have more in common with Turks and Arabs as compared to Indians. We have an indian descent and share a lot with them. There is no harm in accepting this fact.
你（题主）说的是两个民族论。
这是巴基斯坦脱离印度的基础，是的，许多巴基斯坦人确实认为他们与阿拉伯人和土耳其人有更多的共同点(中国人？这说法哪来的？我们先假设你没有提到它 )， 但不是每个人都持有相同的观点。
这种感觉无疑是由宗教所激发的，对于大多数巴基斯坦人来说，宗教胜过一切，无论是文化、历史、语言还是种族，这就是为什么他们觉得自己更像阿拉伯人和土耳其人，他们需要维系这种感觉，否则就很难证明建立一个独立的国家是正当的，如果我们拒绝两个民族论，那么一切都是徒劳的。
现在，既然你问我个人观点，而我是一个巴基斯坦人，那么我的回答是，我不觉得相比印度人，我们和土耳其人和阿拉伯人有更多的共同点，我们有印度血统，和他们有很多共同点，接受这一事实并无害处。
Rana Muhammad Awais
If I have to meet with people from the nations you mentioned above, I'll find more similarities with Indians.
We have absolutely nothing common with Chinese, whether its food, culture, music, religion, nothing. Can't even talk to chinese without using my hands. But china and pakistan are amazing friends and china has, at times, shown its commitment for helping in development of Pakistan. We respect that.
Never met turkish people, I hope to, anything that would be the same would be Religion however that's not enough. Language barrier, european culture and Islamic -secularization would not make anything similar with Pakistanis.
Arabs have very less respect for the Pakistani's there, to what I have heard. So yeah, that's about them.
About India. Similarities are so many with these people that it's absolutely ridiculous we can't travel there or vice versa like other nations.
Whether it's sports, food, language, music, dramas, movies, culture, marriages, ignorance, stupidity, I mean many many things. Seriously, we could be best friends. Religion is absolutely totally different and whatever the reasons, that we are two different nations, best for each other.
如果非要比较你上面提到的那些国家的人，我会说巴基斯坦人和印度人有更多的相似之处。
我们和中国人毫无共同之处，无论是饮食、文化、音乐、宗教，什么都不一样，不打手语我都没法和中国人说话，但中国和巴基斯坦是了不起的朋友，中国有时也表现出帮助巴基斯坦发展的承诺，我们尊重中国。
我从未见过土耳其人，希望哪天能见见，光是相同的宗教并不能说明什么，语言障碍、欧洲文化和伊斯兰世俗化另其与巴基斯坦没有任何相似之处。
据我所知，阿拉伯人很少尊重巴基斯坦人，所以，是的，这就是他们。
至于印度，我们和这些人有很多相似之处，但我们不能去那里旅行，这是绝对荒谬的，反之亦然。
说真的，无论是体育、食物、语言、音乐、戏剧、电影、文化、婚姻、无知、愚蠢（我指的是很多很多事情），我们都可以成为最好的朋友，当然宗教是完全不同的，不管什么原因，我们是两个不同的国家，但最适合彼此。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
If I have to meet with people from the nations you mentioned above, I'll find more similarities with Indians.
We have absolutely nothing common with Chinese, whether its food, culture, music, religion, nothing. Can't even talk to chinese without using my hands. But china and pakistan are amazing friends and china has, at times, shown its commitment for helping in development of Pakistan. We respect that.
Never met turkish people, I hope to, anything that would be the same would be Religion however that's not enough. Language barrier, european culture and Islamic -secularization would not make anything similar with Pakistanis.
Arabs have very less respect for the Pakistani's there, to what I have heard. So yeah, that's about them.
About India. Similarities are so many with these people that it's absolutely ridiculous we can't travel there or vice versa like other nations.
Whether it's sports, food, language, music, dramas, movies, culture, marriages, ignorance, stupidity, I mean many many things. Seriously, we could be best friends. Religion is absolutely totally different and whatever the reasons, that we are two different nations, best for each other.
如果非要比较你上面提到的那些国家的人，我会说巴基斯坦人和印度人有更多的相似之处。
我们和中国人毫无共同之处，无论是饮食、文化、音乐、宗教，什么都不一样，不打手语我都没法和中国人说话，但中国和巴基斯坦是了不起的朋友，中国有时也表现出帮助巴基斯坦发展的承诺，我们尊重中国。
我从未见过土耳其人，希望哪天能见见，光是相同的宗教并不能说明什么，语言障碍、欧洲文化和伊斯兰世俗化另其与巴基斯坦没有任何相似之处。
据我所知，阿拉伯人很少尊重巴基斯坦人，所以，是的，这就是他们。
至于印度，我们和这些人有很多相似之处，但我们不能去那里旅行，这是绝对荒谬的，反之亦然。
说真的，无论是体育、食物、语言、音乐、戏剧、电影、文化、婚姻、无知、愚蠢（我指的是很多很多事情），我们都可以成为最好的朋友，当然宗教是完全不同的，不管什么原因，我们是两个不同的国家，但最适合彼此。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
However,
If Pakistan and India had past these issues which are refraining us to be friendly-neighbors including political, wars, proxies wars, exploiting each other etc, we would have created a europe like environment for common people to progress in science, education, culture, peace, health and many major issues.
I mean, I could have been supporting my cricket team in T20 (die hard fan) at chennai or kolkata
We could have joint research in astronomy, medical and many fiends considering the talent these both nations have.
The fact that we haven't learnt to be tolerant about each other and our religions shows the age of ignorance still existing and prevailing.
Indians and Pakistanis are best friends when met outside their nations due to the same similarities I mentioned.
I wish to have many indian friends that are fans of cricket, are engineers, or astronomers, are desi and can tolerate if I make fun of them if Pakistan wins in t20.
Peace and Love.
然而，如果巴基斯坦和印度能够克服包括政治、战争、代理人战争、相互剥削等在内的各种问题，使我们成为友好邻邦，我们就能创造一个类似欧洲一样的环境，让普通人民在科学、教育、文化、和平、健康和许多重大问题上取得进步。
我的意思是，我本可以T20赛事中支持我的板球队(铁杆球迷)，无论是钦奈队还是加尔各答队。
考虑到这两个国家拥有的人才，我们可以在天文学、医学和许多领域进行联合研究。
事实上，我们还没有学会对彼此和我们的宗教宽容，这表明无知仍然普遍存在和盛行。
由于我提到的相似之处，印度人和巴基斯坦人在国外相遇时是最好的朋友。
我希望许多印度朋友，他们可能是板球迷，可能是工程师，或者是天文学家，如果巴基斯坦在T20中获胜，如果我取笑他们，他们可以容忍。
爱与和平。
If Pakistan and India had past these issues which are refraining us to be friendly-neighbors including political, wars, proxies wars, exploiting each other etc, we would have created a europe like environment for common people to progress in science, education, culture, peace, health and many major issues.
I mean, I could have been supporting my cricket team in T20 (die hard fan) at chennai or kolkata
We could have joint research in astronomy, medical and many fiends considering the talent these both nations have.
The fact that we haven't learnt to be tolerant about each other and our religions shows the age of ignorance still existing and prevailing.
Indians and Pakistanis are best friends when met outside their nations due to the same similarities I mentioned.
I wish to have many indian friends that are fans of cricket, are engineers, or astronomers, are desi and can tolerate if I make fun of them if Pakistan wins in t20.
Peace and Love.
然而，如果巴基斯坦和印度能够克服包括政治、战争、代理人战争、相互剥削等在内的各种问题，使我们成为友好邻邦，我们就能创造一个类似欧洲一样的环境，让普通人民在科学、教育、文化、和平、健康和许多重大问题上取得进步。
我的意思是，我本可以T20赛事中支持我的板球队(铁杆球迷)，无论是钦奈队还是加尔各答队。
考虑到这两个国家拥有的人才，我们可以在天文学、医学和许多领域进行联合研究。
事实上，我们还没有学会对彼此和我们的宗教宽容，这表明无知仍然普遍存在和盛行。
由于我提到的相似之处，印度人和巴基斯坦人在国外相遇时是最好的朋友。
我希望许多印度朋友，他们可能是板球迷，可能是工程师，或者是天文学家，如果巴基斯坦在T20中获胜，如果我取笑他们，他们可以容忍。
爱与和平。
Lee Junaid
Culturally Pakistanis are more similar to Persian culture than Arabian culture.
racially Pakistani Punjabis are more diverse than Indian Punjabi's and the reason for that is A lot of Central Asian people specially afghans settled in Punjab region centuries ago.
In Pakistani Punjab you have Kashmiri Punjabis, Baloch Punjabis, Pashtun Punjsbis. They are also a lot of Uzbek families who has been living in Punjab region for hundreds of years.
To summarize Pakistan
Pakistan is the mixture of India Afghanistan and Iran.
在文化上，巴基斯坦人更近于波斯文化，而不是阿拉伯文化。
从种族上看，巴基斯坦旁遮普人比印度旁遮普人更加多样化，原因是很多中亚人，特别是阿富汗人几个世纪前就在旁遮普地区定居。
在巴基斯坦旁遮普，有克什米尔旁遮普人、俾路支旁遮普人、普什图旁遮普人，还有很多乌兹别克人，他们已经在旁遮普地区生活了几百年。
概括地说，巴基斯坦，是印度、阿富汗和伊朗的混合体。
Culturally Pakistanis are more similar to Persian culture than Arabian culture.
racially Pakistani Punjabis are more diverse than Indian Punjabi's and the reason for that is A lot of Central Asian people specially afghans settled in Punjab region centuries ago.
In Pakistani Punjab you have Kashmiri Punjabis, Baloch Punjabis, Pashtun Punjsbis. They are also a lot of Uzbek families who has been living in Punjab region for hundreds of years.
To summarize Pakistan
Pakistan is the mixture of India Afghanistan and Iran.
在文化上，巴基斯坦人更近于波斯文化，而不是阿拉伯文化。
从种族上看，巴基斯坦旁遮普人比印度旁遮普人更加多样化，原因是很多中亚人，特别是阿富汗人几个世纪前就在旁遮普地区定居。
在巴基斯坦旁遮普，有克什米尔旁遮普人、俾路支旁遮普人、普什图旁遮普人，还有很多乌兹别克人，他们已经在旁遮普地区生活了几百年。
概括地说，巴基斯坦，是印度、阿富汗和伊朗的混合体。
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