英国大学推动“至关重要的”学费上涨
正文翻译
(Vice-chancellors have been urged to take on more domestic applicants amid a battle for higher education places after last week’s A-level results)
（在上周的A-level成绩公布后，大学行政校长们被敦促在争夺高等教育名额的斗争中招收更多的国内申请者）
新闻：
Universities push for ‘vital’ tuition fee rise
-UK students must pay closer to £24,000 a year or lose their places to foreigners, argue bosses
大学推动“至关重要的”学费上涨
——大学老板们认为，英国学生每年必须支付近2.4万英镑的学费，否则招生名额就会被外国人抢走
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
-UK students must pay closer to £24,000 a year or lose their places to foreigners, argue bosses
大学推动“至关重要的”学费上涨
——大学老板们认为，英国学生每年必须支付近2.4万英镑的学费，否则招生名额就会被外国人抢走
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
(Vice-chancellors have been urged to take on more domestic applicants amid a battle for higher education places after last week’s A-level results)
（在上周的A-level成绩公布后，大学行政校长们被敦促在争夺高等教育名额的斗争中招收更多的国内申请者）
新闻：
University bosses are calling for tuition fees to be raised closer to the £24,000 a year average that foreign students pay. They warn the £9,250 paid by UK students, which has been frozen for a decade, is forcing them to take on an ever-increasing number of foreign applicants from countries such as China and India.
大学老板们呼吁将学费提高到接近外国留学生平均每年2.4万英镑的水平。他们警告称，英国学生支付的9250英镑学费已被保持10年，这正迫使他们接受越来越多来自中国和印度等国的外国申请者。
大学老板们呼吁将学费提高到接近外国留学生平均每年2.4万英镑的水平。他们警告称，英国学生支付的9250英镑学费已被保持10年，这正迫使他们接受越来越多来自中国和印度等国的外国申请者。
A record one in five young undergraduates starting at top universities this autumn are from overseas, according to official figures, up 7 per cent in a year. The number of British undergraduates has declined by 13 per cent. School pupils received their A-level results last week, triggering a battle for higher education places and vice-chancellors have been urged to take on more domestic applicants to ease the pressure.
官方数据显示，今年秋季入学的顶尖大学年轻本科生中，有创纪录的五分之一来自海外，这一比例在一年内上升了7%。英国本科生人数下降了13%。上周，英国学生收到了他们的A-level成绩，引发了一场争夺高等教育名额的争夺战，政府敦促校长们招收更多的国内申请者，以缓解压力。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
官方数据显示，今年秋季入学的顶尖大学年轻本科生中，有创纪录的五分之一来自海外，这一比例在一年内上升了7%。英国本科生人数下降了13%。上周，英国学生收到了他们的A-level成绩，引发了一场争夺高等教育名额的争夺战，政府敦促校长们招收更多的国内申请者，以缓解压力。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
However, Sir David Bell, vice-chancellor at the University of Sunderland and a former permanent secretary at the Department for Education, said: “You cannot expect to run universities on a fee level of £9,250 a year, which by 2025 will be worth around £6,000 in real terms because of inflation. “If you want to keep running universities even at the level we have now, you have to increase the tuition fee at some point.” He said universities were simply making “a rational choice” in supplementing their finances with income from overseas students.
然而，桑德兰大学行政校长、教育部前常任秘书大卫·贝尔爵士说：“你不能指望以每年9250英镑的学费水平运营大学，由于通货膨胀，到2025年，这些学费的实际价值将降至6000英镑左右。如果你想保持我们现在的办学水平，就必须在某个时候提高学费。”他表示，各大学只是在用留学生收入补充财务方面做出了“理性选择”。
然而，桑德兰大学行政校长、教育部前常任秘书大卫·贝尔爵士说：“你不能指望以每年9250英镑的学费水平运营大学，由于通货膨胀，到2025年，这些学费的实际价值将降至6000英镑左右。如果你想保持我们现在的办学水平，就必须在某个时候提高学费。”他表示，各大学只是在用留学生收入补充财务方面做出了“理性选择”。
Bell said he would like to be able to recruit foreign students “as a matter of choice, not simply because there is a financial imperative to do it”, adding: “Universities cannot afford not to take more overseas students.” Professor Colin Riordan, vice-chancellor of Cardiff University, said the government had a “national duty to ensure that it was at least viable for us to teach students from this country”. Professor Sir Chris Husbands, vice-chancellor of Sheffield Hallam University, said: “There are high-tariff universities [which ask for very high A-level grades] pulling back from the UK market because they can charge higher prices in international markets. There is an urgent need to look at UK student funding.”
贝尔表示，他希望能够招收外国学生“是一种选择，而不仅仅是因为经济上的必要”，他补充说：“大学不能承受不招收更多海外学生的后果。”卡迪夫大学行政校长科林·里奥丹教授表示，政府“有一项国家责任，确保我们至少有能力教育来自这个国家的学生”。谢菲尔德哈勒姆大学行政校长克里斯·丈夫斯爵士教授说：“有些高价大学（它们要求非常高的A-level成绩）退出了英国市场，因为它们可以在国际市场上收取更高的价格。现在迫切需要关注英国的学生资助。”
贝尔表示，他希望能够招收外国学生“是一种选择，而不仅仅是因为经济上的必要”，他补充说：“大学不能承受不招收更多海外学生的后果。”卡迪夫大学行政校长科林·里奥丹教授表示，政府“有一项国家责任，确保我们至少有能力教育来自这个国家的学生”。谢菲尔德哈勒姆大学行政校长克里斯·丈夫斯爵士教授说：“有些高价大学（它们要求非常高的A-level成绩）退出了英国市场，因为它们可以在国际市场上收取更高的价格。现在迫切需要关注英国的学生资助。”
Stephen Marston, vice-chancellor of the University of Gloucester, said he and other vice-chancellors in England wanted to get into talks with government for a “long-term viable funding model for universities”. Until then, he said, “we are likely to see increasing recruitment of overseas students”. The most sextive institutions, including Oxford, Cambridge and Bristol, turned away four out of ten UK candidates who applied to start a degree course this autumn, according to the Universities and Colleges Admissions Service (Ucas). This is the highest rejection rate ever recorded.
格洛斯特大学行政校长斯蒂芬·马斯顿表示，他和其他英国行政校长希望与政府就“大学长期可行的资助模式”展开谈判。他表示，在那之前，“我们可能会看到越来越多的海外学生入学”。英国大学和学院招生服务中心的数据显示，包括牛津、剑桥和布里斯托尔在内的最挑剔的院校拒绝了四成申请今年秋季开设学位课程的英国本土申请者。这是有史以来最高的拒收率。
格洛斯特大学行政校长斯蒂芬·马斯顿表示，他和其他英国行政校长希望与政府就“大学长期可行的资助模式”展开谈判。他表示，在那之前，“我们可能会看到越来越多的海外学生入学”。英国大学和学院招生服务中心的数据显示，包括牛津、剑桥和布里斯托尔在内的最挑剔的院校拒绝了四成申请今年秋季开设学位课程的英国本土申请者。这是有史以来最高的拒收率。
Overseas students are being enrolled at a higher rate than British ones at the most elite universities, according to a new analysis of admissions data by the consultancy DataHE. Its founder, Mark Corver, who is the former head of data at Ucas, said there was an “accelerating trend” for a higher share of places at top universities going to students paying higher fees. For students accepted to start at these universities this autumn, the number of those paying £9,250 has dropped by 12,000, a fall of 13 per cent on last year, to just under 80,000. The number of those paying higher fees has jumped by 1,400, up 7 per cent, according to an analysis of the latest Ucas data.
咨询公司DataHE对招生数据的一项新分析显示，在最顶尖的大学，海外学生的入学率高于英国学生。该网站的创始人、英国大学招生办公室前数据主管马克·科尔弗表示，有一种“加速发展的趋势”，即支付更高学费的学生在顶尖大学获得的名额比例越来越高。今年秋季被这些大学录取的学生中，支付9250英镑入学费用的人数减少了1.2万人，比去年减少了13%，降至略低于8万人。对英国高等院校招生办公室最新数据的一项分析显示，支付更高学费的人数增加了1400人，增幅为7%。
咨询公司DataHE对招生数据的一项新分析显示，在最顶尖的大学，海外学生的入学率高于英国学生。该网站的创始人、英国大学招生办公室前数据主管马克·科尔弗表示，有一种“加速发展的趋势”，即支付更高学费的学生在顶尖大学获得的名额比例越来越高。今年秋季被这些大学录取的学生中，支付9250英镑入学费用的人数减少了1.2万人，比去年减少了13%，降至略低于8万人。对英国高等院校招生办公室最新数据的一项分析显示，支付更高学费的人数增加了1400人，增幅为7%。
If tuition fees had kept pace with inflation, they would now be £12,000 a year, rather than £9,250. Students are graduating with loan debts of £50,000 on average. Would-be medical students face a particularly difficult challenge to secure a place as the government has capped the number it helps to fund at 7,500, with strict quotas for each medical school. They can recruit up to 7.5 per cent of their intake from overseas students, who can be charged up to £45,000 a year. About 85 per cent of British students who applied to medical school were rejected, despite the shortage of GPs and hospital doctors.
如果学费与通货膨胀保持同步，现在的学费应该是每年1.2万英镑，而不是9250英镑。学生毕业时平均背负着5万英镑的贷款债务。想要申请医学院的学生面临着一个特别困难的挑战，因为政府将其资助的人数限制在7500人，每个医学院都有严格的配额。它们最多可以从海外学生中招收7.5%的学生，而海外学生每年的学费最高可达4.5万英镑。尽管缺乏全科医生和医院医生，但申请医学院的英国本土学生中仍有约85%被拒绝。
如果学费与通货膨胀保持同步，现在的学费应该是每年1.2万英镑，而不是9250英镑。学生毕业时平均背负着5万英镑的贷款债务。想要申请医学院的学生面临着一个特别困难的挑战，因为政府将其资助的人数限制在7500人，每个医学院都有严格的配额。它们最多可以从海外学生中招收7.5%的学生，而海外学生每年的学费最高可达4.5万英镑。尽管缺乏全科医生和医院医生，但申请医学院的英国本土学生中仍有约85%被拒绝。
Professor Karol Sikora, who set up the University of Buckingham medical school, called for fees between UK and overseas students to be “equalised”. He said the UK fee should rise to between £12,000 and £13,000. “It is heartbreaking that we are having to turn away bright British students with straight As who want to be doctors. We have a moral obligation to train more British doctors. We should be self-sufficient in the NHS,” he said. Last week James Cleverly, the education secretary, defended the government’s refusal to lift the cap. Jeremy Hunt, the former health secretary, said the decision “beggars belief.
白金汉大学医学院的创始人卡罗尔·西科拉教授呼吁，英国学生和海外学生之间的学费应该“平等”。他表示，英国的学费应该升至1.2万英镑至1.3万英镑之间。“我们不得不拒绝那些想当医生、成绩全A的聪明的英国本土学生，这令人心碎。我们有培养更多英国医生的道德义务。国家医疗体系应该自给自足，”他说。上周，教育大臣詹姆斯·克莱弗利为政府拒绝取消上限辩护。前卫生大臣杰里米·亨特表示，这一决定“令人难以置信”。
白金汉大学医学院的创始人卡罗尔·西科拉教授呼吁，英国学生和海外学生之间的学费应该“平等”。他表示，英国的学费应该升至1.2万英镑至1.3万英镑之间。“我们不得不拒绝那些想当医生、成绩全A的聪明的英国本土学生，这令人心碎。我们有培养更多英国医生的道德义务。国家医疗体系应该自给自足，”他说。上周，教育大臣詹姆斯·克莱弗利为政府拒绝取消上限辩护。前卫生大臣杰里米·亨特表示，这一决定“令人难以置信”。
A Department for Education spokesman said: “The student finance system must be fair for students, universities and the taxpayer, and it is right that we have frozen tuition fees to reduce the burden of debt on graduates. To support universities, we’re providing £750 million extra funding over the next three years. “It is a myth that offering a place to an international student takes a place away from a student in the UK. They actually support the creation of more places for domestic students.”
教育部发言人说：“学生财政系统必须对学生、大学和纳税人公平，我们冻结学费以减轻毕业生的债务负担是正确的。为了支持大学，我们将在未来三年提供7.5亿英镑的额外资金。给国际学生提供一个名额就会让英国学生失去一个名额——这是一个误区。他们实际上支持为国内学生创造了更多的学校名额。”
教育部发言人说：“学生财政系统必须对学生、大学和纳税人公平，我们冻结学费以减轻毕业生的债务负担是正确的。为了支持大学，我们将在未来三年提供7.5亿英镑的额外资金。给国际学生提供一个名额就会让英国学生失去一个名额——这是一个误区。他们实际上支持为国内学生创造了更多的学校名额。”
评论翻译
BritishAccentTechLong Covid is Long
UK students pay less than overseas students because UK students benefit the UK economy for their entire working lives afterwards, while overseas students largely do not. There used to be lots of other reasons, but apparently everything is late stage capitalism now.
If the system is set up such that Universities are incentivised to allow less and less UK students, then the system should be changed to mitigate that, but not by tripling fees for the second time in my adult life.
Universities are supposed to be a societal good, not a contract to a lifetime of crushing debt like the US system.
英国学生的学费比海外学生低，是因为英国学生在毕业后的整个工作生涯中都造福于英国经济，而海外学生基本上不会。过去有很多其他原因，但显然现在一切都是晚期资本主义。
如果这个体系的建立能够激励大学录取越来越少的英国学生，那么这个体系就应该做出改变来缓解这一问题，但措施不是在我成年后第二次将学费提高两倍。
大学应该是一种社会福利，而不是像美国那样终生背负沉重债务的契约。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
UK students pay less than overseas students because UK students benefit the UK economy for their entire working lives afterwards, while overseas students largely do not. There used to be lots of other reasons, but apparently everything is late stage capitalism now.
If the system is set up such that Universities are incentivised to allow less and less UK students, then the system should be changed to mitigate that, but not by tripling fees for the second time in my adult life.
Universities are supposed to be a societal good, not a contract to a lifetime of crushing debt like the US system.
英国学生的学费比海外学生低，是因为英国学生在毕业后的整个工作生涯中都造福于英国经济，而海外学生基本上不会。过去有很多其他原因，但显然现在一切都是晚期资本主义。
如果这个体系的建立能够激励大学录取越来越少的英国学生，那么这个体系就应该做出改变来缓解这一问题，但措施不是在我成年后第二次将学费提高两倍。
大学应该是一种社会福利，而不是像美国那样终生背负沉重债务的契约。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
markhewitt1978
When I went to University in the mid 1990s it was free for the same reason. Me getting a degree was a benefit to the country and economy, not just me.
You can say the same for Primary and Secondary school.
上世纪90年代中期我上大学的时候，因为同样的原因，大学是免费的。我获得学位不仅对我自己有好处，对国家和经济也有好处。
小学和中学也是如此。
When I went to University in the mid 1990s it was free for the same reason. Me getting a degree was a benefit to the country and economy, not just me.
You can say the same for Primary and Secondary school.
上世纪90年代中期我上大学的时候，因为同样的原因，大学是免费的。我获得学位不仅对我自己有好处，对国家和经济也有好处。
小学和中学也是如此。
Vegan_Force
I totally agree. The future of countries like the UK or any country relies on the quality of education that is delivered to its youths and the quality of doctors, engineers, lawyers, finance professionals, scientists, etc the universities produce. If the country respect its youth and provide good education/care to its youth, when youth becomes an adult he/she/them will feel accountable and think about country’s/society’s growth along with their self growth.
However, in country’s like America, because of the way the education system works, the first priority is to find a job (doesn’t matter if it’s good or bad to the country as far as it’s legal) and start repaying the loan. This educational debt carried by youth is a huge curse to any country’s growth.
我完全赞同。像英国或任何国家的未来都依赖于提供给年轻人的教育质量，以及大学培养的医生、工程师、律师、金融专业人士、科学家等的质量。如果国家尊重它们的年轻人，给他们提供良好的教育和照顾，当他们长大成人时，他们就会感到有责任，会在自我成长的同时思考国家/社会的成长。
然而，在像美国这样的国家，由于教育系统的运作方式，第一要务是找到一份工作（只要合法，对国家是好是坏并不重要），并开始偿还贷款。年轻人背负的教育债务对任何国家的发展都是一个巨大的诅咒。
I totally agree. The future of countries like the UK or any country relies on the quality of education that is delivered to its youths and the quality of doctors, engineers, lawyers, finance professionals, scientists, etc the universities produce. If the country respect its youth and provide good education/care to its youth, when youth becomes an adult he/she/them will feel accountable and think about country’s/society’s growth along with their self growth.
However, in country’s like America, because of the way the education system works, the first priority is to find a job (doesn’t matter if it’s good or bad to the country as far as it’s legal) and start repaying the loan. This educational debt carried by youth is a huge curse to any country’s growth.
我完全赞同。像英国或任何国家的未来都依赖于提供给年轻人的教育质量，以及大学培养的医生、工程师、律师、金融专业人士、科学家等的质量。如果国家尊重它们的年轻人，给他们提供良好的教育和照顾，当他们长大成人时，他们就会感到有责任，会在自我成长的同时思考国家/社会的成长。
然而，在像美国这样的国家，由于教育系统的运作方式，第一要务是找到一份工作（只要合法，对国家是好是坏并不重要），并开始偿还贷款。年轻人背负的教育债务对任何国家的发展都是一个巨大的诅咒。
MrPuddington2
Yes, but while UK education is a public good, universities are not public organisations. They need to be funded somehow, and at the moment, that very money is just missing. Government funding is less than 1000 Pound per student (although it is complicated to calculated). Fees are 9250, costs are around 11000, rising to 12000.
And you have to remember that places were few and limited when studying was free. Increasing participation was not possible under the public funding model.
没错，但尽管英国教育是一种公共产品，大学却不是公共组织。它们需要某种形式的资金，而目前，这些资金正在消失。政府资助每个学生不到1000英镑（尽管计算起来很复杂）。学费9250，开销11000左右，能涨到12000。
你必须记住，当学习是免费的时候，地方会很少，有限。
Yes, but while UK education is a public good, universities are not public organisations. They need to be funded somehow, and at the moment, that very money is just missing. Government funding is less than 1000 Pound per student (although it is complicated to calculated). Fees are 9250, costs are around 11000, rising to 12000.
And you have to remember that places were few and limited when studying was free. Increasing participation was not possible under the public funding model.
没错，但尽管英国教育是一种公共产品，大学却不是公共组织。它们需要某种形式的资金，而目前，这些资金正在消失。政府资助每个学生不到1000英镑（尽管计算起来很复杂）。学费9250，开销11000左右，能涨到12000。
你必须记住，当学习是免费的时候，地方会很少，有限。
Donutttt
Does anyone look and this and think, what's the consequence of making university so expensive that it's no longer an attractive proposition to people who live here? Whatever happened to the idea that people being well educated is a general public good in and of itself, regardless of how much money is generated to repay loans?
有没有人看到这里会想，让大学变得如此昂贵，以至于对生活在这里的人不再有吸引力了，这有什么后果呢？人们接受良好教育本身就是一种公共利益，不管会产生多少钱来偿还贷款，这种理念到底发生了什么？
Does anyone look and this and think, what's the consequence of making university so expensive that it's no longer an attractive proposition to people who live here? Whatever happened to the idea that people being well educated is a general public good in and of itself, regardless of how much money is generated to repay loans?
有没有人看到这里会想，让大学变得如此昂贵，以至于对生活在这里的人不再有吸引力了，这有什么后果呢？人们接受良好教育本身就是一种公共利益，不管会产生多少钱来偿还贷款，这种理念到底发生了什么？
Uvanimor
The UK is regressing, they don't want to tell the general public "Actually, we have no export economy, are bankrupting ourselves on import economies and would much prefer spending money pretending to be a geopolitical superpower when we're simply not, rather than actually pay for anything the public will benefit from."
These fees are increasing because we refuse to tax the rich, and are losing control of the finances of the working class due to our import economy.
The UK is quickly becoming the "Third World Country wearing a Gucci Belt" we make fun of the US for.
英国正在倒退，他们不想告诉公众“实际上，我们没有出口经济，我们在进口经济上让自己破产，而且宁愿花钱假装自己是一个地缘政治超级大国，而我们根本不是，而不是真正为公众将从中受益的任何东西买单。”
这些费用之所以增加，是因为我们拒绝向富人征税，而且由于进口经济，我们正在失去对工人阶级财政的控制。
英国正迅速成为我们嘲笑美国的“戴着古驰腰带的第三世界国家”。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
The UK is regressing, they don't want to tell the general public "Actually, we have no export economy, are bankrupting ourselves on import economies and would much prefer spending money pretending to be a geopolitical superpower when we're simply not, rather than actually pay for anything the public will benefit from."
These fees are increasing because we refuse to tax the rich, and are losing control of the finances of the working class due to our import economy.
The UK is quickly becoming the "Third World Country wearing a Gucci Belt" we make fun of the US for.
英国正在倒退，他们不想告诉公众“实际上，我们没有出口经济，我们在进口经济上让自己破产，而且宁愿花钱假装自己是一个地缘政治超级大国，而我们根本不是，而不是真正为公众将从中受益的任何东西买单。”
这些费用之所以增加，是因为我们拒绝向富人征税，而且由于进口经济，我们正在失去对工人阶级财政的控制。
英国正迅速成为我们嘲笑美国的“戴着古驰腰带的第三世界国家”。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
loobricated
I just don't get the maths of this. If every student is paying these crazy amounts of money, where is all that money going at the university side? Based on my experience at undergraduate level and post grad I got a few hours of a few academic's time a week.
If people are paying £24,000 each, that takes three students tuition to cover the yearly salary of one academic. Three!! And individual academics are teaching hundreds!
So what the actual fuck? Where is that money going because it's not on textbooks, accommodation, or anything else useful for the students as they are all costing extra. At my post graduate university, one of the oldest most respected unis in UK, they even insisted I pay a fee just to be allowed to graduate, which irritated me so much.
我就是不懂其中的数学原理。如果每个学生都要支付这么多的钱，那么大学方面的钱都去哪了？根据我在本科和研究生阶段的经验，我每周只上几个小时的大学教师的课。
如果每人支付24000英镑，那么三个学生的学费就够一个大学教师的年薪了。三个！！而大学教师会同时给几百个学生上课！
那到底是怎么回事？这些钱都花在哪里了呢？因为这些钱不是花在课本、住宿或其他对学生有用的东西上，因为这些都是额外的费用。我的研究生学校是英国历史最悠久、最受尊敬的大学之一，他们甚至坚持让我交学费，只为了能毕业，这让我非常恼火。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
I just don't get the maths of this. If every student is paying these crazy amounts of money, where is all that money going at the university side? Based on my experience at undergraduate level and post grad I got a few hours of a few academic's time a week.
If people are paying £24,000 each, that takes three students tuition to cover the yearly salary of one academic. Three!! And individual academics are teaching hundreds!
So what the actual fuck? Where is that money going because it's not on textbooks, accommodation, or anything else useful for the students as they are all costing extra. At my post graduate university, one of the oldest most respected unis in UK, they even insisted I pay a fee just to be allowed to graduate, which irritated me so much.
我就是不懂其中的数学原理。如果每个学生都要支付这么多的钱，那么大学方面的钱都去哪了？根据我在本科和研究生阶段的经验，我每周只上几个小时的大学教师的课。
如果每人支付24000英镑，那么三个学生的学费就够一个大学教师的年薪了。三个！！而大学教师会同时给几百个学生上课！
那到底是怎么回事？这些钱都花在哪里了呢？因为这些钱不是花在课本、住宿或其他对学生有用的东西上，因为这些都是额外的费用。我的研究生学校是英国历史最悠久、最受尊敬的大学之一，他们甚至坚持让我交学费，只为了能毕业，这让我非常恼火。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
serennow
In one sense the maths is incredibly simple - inflation has been non-zero for 10 years and currently is 10%. So if you assume fees must be the model (I don’t like that) and they were fair when introduced (you’d probably argue that) then it’s clear they must go up.
On where the money is going here’s some not checked or thought through fag packet maths - 8 years ago I was a lecturer on around £30k (let’s bump that to £60k to cover the full economic cost, ie include pension, employer NI, office space, etc). One part of my yearly duties (about 20% on paper) was to teach a 1st year course with 300 students. So I was “paid £12k” to teach that course.
This course was 1/15th of the year for the students. If you assume 2/3rds of what each student pays go to things over than the lecturer (who wrote the lecture notes, delivered all sessions, wrote and marked all exams, etc) then you find 300 students paid £3k divided by 15 = £60k. Where did the £48k go?
从某种意义上说，这个数学原理其实非常简单——通货膨胀10年来一直不是零，目前是10%。所以，如果你认为收费必须是一种模式（我不喜欢那样），而且它们在实施时是公平的（你可能会说），那么很明显它们必须上升。
关于钱的去向，这里有一些没有经过核实或思考的问题——8年前，我是一名讲师，薪资大约3万英镑（让我们把这个数字提高到6万英镑，以覆盖全部经济成本，如养老金、用人单位国民保险、办公场所等等）。我每年的职责之一（大约20%是书面的）就是教授300名学生的第一年课程。所以我教这门课“赚了1.2万英镑”。
这门课是学生一学年任务的1/15。如果你假设每个学生支付的费用的三分之二超过了讲师（他写了课堂笔记，交付了所有的课程，写了所有的考试，等等），那么你会发现300名学生支付了3000英镑除以15 = 60000英镑。48000英镑去了哪里？
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
In one sense the maths is incredibly simple - inflation has been non-zero for 10 years and currently is 10%. So if you assume fees must be the model (I don’t like that) and they were fair when introduced (you’d probably argue that) then it’s clear they must go up.
On where the money is going here’s some not checked or thought through fag packet maths - 8 years ago I was a lecturer on around £30k (let’s bump that to £60k to cover the full economic cost, ie include pension, employer NI, office space, etc). One part of my yearly duties (about 20% on paper) was to teach a 1st year course with 300 students. So I was “paid £12k” to teach that course.
This course was 1/15th of the year for the students. If you assume 2/3rds of what each student pays go to things over than the lecturer (who wrote the lecture notes, delivered all sessions, wrote and marked all exams, etc) then you find 300 students paid £3k divided by 15 = £60k. Where did the £48k go?
从某种意义上说，这个数学原理其实非常简单——通货膨胀10年来一直不是零，目前是10%。所以，如果你认为收费必须是一种模式（我不喜欢那样），而且它们在实施时是公平的（你可能会说），那么很明显它们必须上升。
关于钱的去向，这里有一些没有经过核实或思考的问题——8年前，我是一名讲师，薪资大约3万英镑（让我们把这个数字提高到6万英镑，以覆盖全部经济成本，如养老金、用人单位国民保险、办公场所等等）。我每年的职责之一（大约20%是书面的）就是教授300名学生的第一年课程。所以我教这门课“赚了1.2万英镑”。
这门课是学生一学年任务的1/15。如果你假设每个学生支付的费用的三分之二超过了讲师（他写了课堂笔记，交付了所有的课程，写了所有的考试，等等），那么你会发现300名学生支付了3000英镑除以15 = 60000英镑。48000英镑去了哪里？
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
superioso
Here in Denmark students get free tuition and also get paid monthly by the government in order to live. Taxes are higher to pay for it of course, but it promotes social mobility.
Meanwhile, by living there I have to pay student loans and the higher taxes.
在丹麦，学生可以免交学费，每个月还能拿到政府的生活费。当然，为了支付它，税收会更高，但它促进了社会流动性。
与此同时，由于住在那里，我必须支付学生贷款和更高的税收。
Here in Denmark students get free tuition and also get paid monthly by the government in order to live. Taxes are higher to pay for it of course, but it promotes social mobility.
Meanwhile, by living there I have to pay student loans and the higher taxes.
在丹麦，学生可以免交学费，每个月还能拿到政府的生活费。当然，为了支付它，税收会更高，但它促进了社会流动性。
与此同时，由于住在那里，我必须支付学生贷款和更高的税收。
SoothingWind
Yeah in Finland too, there are several governmental grants that vary according to your need (children over/under 18, number of children, wage, if your area is remote and you have to have some special transportation, type of housing, if you're an immigrant etc.) And university, and, as of this year, the full schooling experience is free for both finns and EU students (before, you had to pay some little fee for high school plus computers and books, now they give both for free, effectively leaving uni books as the only cost students have that the education system can control)
Taxes are pretty high too but of course you get a ton of things that even if you had 0% taxes most people couldn't buy with their full income (paternity and maternity leave, cheap public transport, free school, free healthcare, an extremely robust welfare system, a competent government etc...)
However, for non EU students, fees in most unis are €10k, (still not terrible if this £24k thing will get approved also for English students.)
是的，在芬兰也是，根据你的需要有几种不同的政府补贴（18岁以上/以下的孩子，孩子的数量，工资，如果你所在的地区很偏远，你需要一些特殊的交通工具，住房类型，如果你是移民等等）。还有大学，从今年开始，对芬兰人和欧盟学生来说，全部的教育体验都是免费的（以前，你必须为高中加上电脑和书籍支付一些费用，现在他们免费提供这两种费用，实际上让大学的教材费成了教育系统可以控制的唯一学生开销）。
税收也相当高，但当然你会得到很多很多即使你的税收为零，大多数人也无法用他们的全部收入购买的东西（陪产假、廉价的公共交通、免费学校、免费医疗、极其健全的福利体系、称职的政府等等……）
然而，对于非欧盟国家的学生来说，大多数大学的学费是1万欧元（当然，假如英国学生2.4万英镑的学费能够被批准的话，比起来好像也不算可怕）。
Yeah in Finland too, there are several governmental grants that vary according to your need (children over/under 18, number of children, wage, if your area is remote and you have to have some special transportation, type of housing, if you're an immigrant etc.) And university, and, as of this year, the full schooling experience is free for both finns and EU students (before, you had to pay some little fee for high school plus computers and books, now they give both for free, effectively leaving uni books as the only cost students have that the education system can control)
Taxes are pretty high too but of course you get a ton of things that even if you had 0% taxes most people couldn't buy with their full income (paternity and maternity leave, cheap public transport, free school, free healthcare, an extremely robust welfare system, a competent government etc...)
However, for non EU students, fees in most unis are €10k, (still not terrible if this £24k thing will get approved also for English students.)
是的，在芬兰也是，根据你的需要有几种不同的政府补贴（18岁以上/以下的孩子，孩子的数量，工资，如果你所在的地区很偏远，你需要一些特殊的交通工具，住房类型，如果你是移民等等）。还有大学，从今年开始，对芬兰人和欧盟学生来说，全部的教育体验都是免费的（以前，你必须为高中加上电脑和书籍支付一些费用，现在他们免费提供这两种费用，实际上让大学的教材费成了教育系统可以控制的唯一学生开销）。
税收也相当高，但当然你会得到很多很多即使你的税收为零，大多数人也无法用他们的全部收入购买的东西（陪产假、廉价的公共交通、免费学校、免费医疗、极其健全的福利体系、称职的政府等等……）
然而，对于非欧盟国家的学生来说，大多数大学的学费是1万欧元（当然，假如英国学生2.4万英镑的学费能够被批准的话，比起来好像也不算可怕）。
eeeking
Apart from the fact that I think University education should be free, I think £9k per year is already excessive, but should obviously be adjusted for inflation. Despite the higher fees paid by foreign students, the total income universities receive from the gov't is far greater than that from foreign students.
除了我认为大学教育应该是免费的这一事实之外，我认为每年9000英镑已经太多了，但显然应该根据通货膨胀进行调整。尽管外国学生支付的费用更高，但大学从政府获得的总收入远远高于外国学生的学费。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Apart from the fact that I think University education should be free, I think £9k per year is already excessive, but should obviously be adjusted for inflation. Despite the higher fees paid by foreign students, the total income universities receive from the gov't is far greater than that from foreign students.
除了我认为大学教育应该是免费的这一事实之外，我认为每年9000英镑已经太多了，但显然应该根据通货膨胀进行调整。尽管外国学生支付的费用更高，但大学从政府获得的总收入远远高于外国学生的学费。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
felesroo
Universities are being run FOR PROFIT now and it's horrendous. UK Universities have been broken by the profit motive and at least the one I have insight to bends over backwards to sell out to rich Chinese students. Local students are completely thrown under the bus. Frankly, it's little better than a diploma mill now, and this is a Russell Group we're talking about.
Higher education is in an absolute shambles. There's bloated administration, a brain drain from the faculty, the staff positions are overworked and understaffed, students have paid for a degree and they'll get it regardless of their marks... what is the point of this farce?
Make education free, let profs fail out bad and cheating students, restrict foreign placements, and remove the profit motive. Get rid of 90% of the administration and especially these corrupt VPs/Chancellors who will suck any dick for more money while destroying the reputation of their institution.
Higher ed in in the UK is failing and unless you're on the inside, you have no idea how bad it really is.
现在的大学都以盈利为目的，这太可怕了。英国大学已经被利润动机所破坏了，至少在我看来是这样的，他们不遗余力地向富有的中国留学生出卖了自己。本地学生完全被抛弃了。坦白说，现在这里比文凭工厂好不了多少，我们说的是罗素集团。
高等教育完全是一团糟。臃肿的行政管理，教职员工的人才流失，教职员工过度工作，人手不足，学生们付了学费，不管成绩如何，他们都能拿到学位……这场闹剧的意义是什么？
让教育免费，让教授们淘汰不合格和作弊的学生，限制外国就业，消除利润动机。精简90%的行政人员，尤其是这些会为了更多的钱而XX任何人的X巴，同时破坏机构声誉的腐败的行政校长们。
英国的高等教育正在失败，除非你身处其中，否则你根本不知道它到底有多糟糕。
Universities are being run FOR PROFIT now and it's horrendous. UK Universities have been broken by the profit motive and at least the one I have insight to bends over backwards to sell out to rich Chinese students. Local students are completely thrown under the bus. Frankly, it's little better than a diploma mill now, and this is a Russell Group we're talking about.
Higher education is in an absolute shambles. There's bloated administration, a brain drain from the faculty, the staff positions are overworked and understaffed, students have paid for a degree and they'll get it regardless of their marks... what is the point of this farce?
Make education free, let profs fail out bad and cheating students, restrict foreign placements, and remove the profit motive. Get rid of 90% of the administration and especially these corrupt VPs/Chancellors who will suck any dick for more money while destroying the reputation of their institution.
Higher ed in in the UK is failing and unless you're on the inside, you have no idea how bad it really is.
现在的大学都以盈利为目的，这太可怕了。英国大学已经被利润动机所破坏了，至少在我看来是这样的，他们不遗余力地向富有的中国留学生出卖了自己。本地学生完全被抛弃了。坦白说，现在这里比文凭工厂好不了多少，我们说的是罗素集团。
高等教育完全是一团糟。臃肿的行政管理，教职员工的人才流失，教职员工过度工作，人手不足，学生们付了学费，不管成绩如何，他们都能拿到学位……这场闹剧的意义是什么？
让教育免费，让教授们淘汰不合格和作弊的学生，限制外国就业，消除利润动机。精简90%的行政人员，尤其是这些会为了更多的钱而XX任何人的X巴，同时破坏机构声誉的腐败的行政校长们。
英国的高等教育正在失败，除非你身处其中，否则你根本不知道它到底有多糟糕。
Ok-Butterscotch4486
I think at some point we have to decide whether everyone needs to be going to university. I work in tech and it's the first thing on every job spec, but feels like the least important thing.
To be a science superpower perhaps we need the government to fund places for the very brightest, the people who will go on to be academics or technological geniuses (and equivalent for the creative subjects which are also supposed to be a strength of Britain).
I don't know why we're going through this grade inflation merry-go-round where everyone had to have GCSEs, then A-Levels, then a degree, and now increasingly a Master's...when it's not really making most people any better at their jobs, and most people don't even stay in the field.
我认为在某个时刻，我们必须决定是否每个人都需要上大学。我在科技行业工作，这（大学学历）是每个工作岗位要求的第一项，但感觉是最不重要的。
要成为一个科学超级大国，也许我们需要政府来资助那些非常聪明的人，那些将来会成为学者或技术天才的人（以及同样被认为是英国优势的创造性学科）。
我不知道为什么我们要经历这种分数膨胀的旋转木马，每个人都必须获得普通中等教育证书，然后是A-levels，然后是学位，现在越来越多的是硕士学位……而当它不能让大多数人在工作上做得更好时，大多数人甚至不会留在这个（学位专业）领域。
I think at some point we have to decide whether everyone needs to be going to university. I work in tech and it's the first thing on every job spec, but feels like the least important thing.
To be a science superpower perhaps we need the government to fund places for the very brightest, the people who will go on to be academics or technological geniuses (and equivalent for the creative subjects which are also supposed to be a strength of Britain).
I don't know why we're going through this grade inflation merry-go-round where everyone had to have GCSEs, then A-Levels, then a degree, and now increasingly a Master's...when it's not really making most people any better at their jobs, and most people don't even stay in the field.
我认为在某个时刻，我们必须决定是否每个人都需要上大学。我在科技行业工作，这（大学学历）是每个工作岗位要求的第一项，但感觉是最不重要的。
要成为一个科学超级大国，也许我们需要政府来资助那些非常聪明的人，那些将来会成为学者或技术天才的人（以及同样被认为是英国优势的创造性学科）。
我不知道为什么我们要经历这种分数膨胀的旋转木马，每个人都必须获得普通中等教育证书，然后是A-levels，然后是学位，现在越来越多的是硕士学位……而当它不能让大多数人在工作上做得更好时，大多数人甚至不会留在这个（学位专业）领域。
No-Scholar4854
The idea of students paying the full £24k is ridiculous, but so is holding the money that universities receive at £9k.
Universities have received £9k per student since 2012. That’s a big real terms cut in income. Everyone is rightly complaining about the cut in face-to-face tuition, but there’s a limit to what £9k pays for.
让学生全额支付2.4万英镑的想法是荒谬的，但保持大学获得9000英镑也同样荒谬。
自2012年以来，各大学从每名学生获得9000英镑。这对收入来说是一个很大的实际削减。每个人都有理由抱怨面对面教学的削减，但9000英镑的学费能换来什么是有上限的。
The idea of students paying the full £24k is ridiculous, but so is holding the money that universities receive at £9k.
Universities have received £9k per student since 2012. That’s a big real terms cut in income. Everyone is rightly complaining about the cut in face-to-face tuition, but there’s a limit to what £9k pays for.
让学生全额支付2.4万英镑的想法是荒谬的，但保持大学获得9000英镑也同样荒谬。
自2012年以来，各大学从每名学生获得9000英镑。这对收入来说是一个很大的实际削减。每个人都有理由抱怨面对面教学的削减，但9000英镑的学费能换来什么是有上限的。
Plastic_Candy_4509
So we voted for Brexit to stop British jobs going to foreign workers. We've got all our fruit picking, toilet cleaning jobs back. Now we're only going to train rich "foreigners" for the high-paying upper level jobs. Is that a win for equality and diversity? If ever there was an example of how this has always been a class war, this is it.
所以我们投票支持脱欧，以阻止英国的工作岗位流向外国工人。采摘水果，打扫厕所的活儿都回来了。现在我们只会训练富有的“外国人”去做高薪的高级工作。这是平等和多样性的胜利吗？如果说有什么例子能说明这一直是一场阶级战争，那它就是了。
So we voted for Brexit to stop British jobs going to foreign workers. We've got all our fruit picking, toilet cleaning jobs back. Now we're only going to train rich "foreigners" for the high-paying upper level jobs. Is that a win for equality and diversity? If ever there was an example of how this has always been a class war, this is it.
所以我们投票支持脱欧，以阻止英国的工作岗位流向外国工人。采摘水果，打扫厕所的活儿都回来了。现在我们只会训练富有的“外国人”去做高薪的高级工作。这是平等和多样性的胜利吗？如果说有什么例子能说明这一直是一场阶级战争，那它就是了。
Stozy
Funny how universities are keen on tracking inflation with fees and yet never do so with staff wages.
Lots of money wasted on shiny new buildings and vanity projects, plus obscene salaries and expenses for the few at the top.
大学热衷于用学费来跟踪通货膨胀，却从不用员工工资来跟踪，真是太搞笑了。
大量的钱被浪费在了光鲜亮丽的新建筑和面子工程上，再加上少数高层的巨额工资和支出。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Funny how universities are keen on tracking inflation with fees and yet never do so with staff wages.
Lots of money wasted on shiny new buildings and vanity projects, plus obscene salaries and expenses for the few at the top.
大学热衷于用学费来跟踪通货膨胀，却从不用员工工资来跟踪，真是太搞笑了。
大量的钱被浪费在了光鲜亮丽的新建筑和面子工程上，再加上少数高层的巨额工资和支出。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Brexiteer27
We should be prioritising British students when it comes to university places, universities just want foreign student for their money.
在大学招生名额方面，我们应该优先考虑英国本土学生，大学只是为了赚钱才招收外国留学生的。
We should be prioritising British students when it comes to university places, universities just want foreign student for their money.
在大学招生名额方面，我们应该优先考虑英国本土学生，大学只是为了赚钱才招收外国留学生的。
LL112
How about we jack up the price exponentially for foreign students and make it free for UK students? Otherwise we are just selling British certificates to the highest bidder, they all go back to their own country and we dont benefit at all economically or societally.
我们何不成倍提高外国学生的学费，让英国学生免费上学呢？否则，我们就只是把英国大学证书卖给出价最高的人，他们都回自己的国家去了，对我们的经济和社会一点好处都没有。
How about we jack up the price exponentially for foreign students and make it free for UK students? Otherwise we are just selling British certificates to the highest bidder, they all go back to their own country and we dont benefit at all economically or societally.
我们何不成倍提高外国学生的学费，让英国学生免费上学呢？否则，我们就只是把英国大学证书卖给出价最高的人，他们都回自己的国家去了，对我们的经济和社会一点好处都没有。
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