欧盟圈讨论：在美洲作物传入欧洲之前，欧洲人都吃些什么？
正文翻译
(来自欧洲问答版块）
(来自欧洲问答版块）
评论翻译
Does that mean there were turnip fries/mashed turnips in Europe before the introduction of the potato?
（回）这是否意味着在引入土豆之前，欧洲就有了炸萝卜条/萝卜泥？
（图为Brotzeit为原产自南德的传统餐点）
KarhuIII
Turnip was the root vegetable of choise before potato
（芬）在出现土豆之前，萝卜（芜菁）是首选的根茎类蔬菜。
Turnip was the root vegetable of choise before potato
（芬）在出现土豆之前，萝卜（芜菁）是首选的根茎类蔬菜。
Also swedes were common before introduction of potato.
（回，芬）在引进土豆之前，瑞典人也很常见。
（回，芬）在引进土豆之前，瑞典人也很常见。
They're still common, there's like 10 million of them
（回，芬）至今都很常见，大约有1000万个。
（译注：瑞典人口数为1041万）
（回，芬）至今都很常见，大约有1000万个。
（译注：瑞典人口数为1041万）
that and parsnip
（回，奥）这个，还有欧防风
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
（回，奥）这个，还有欧防风
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Does that mean there were turnip fries/mashed turnips in Europe before the introduction of the potato?
（回）这是否意味着在引入土豆之前，欧洲就有了炸萝卜条/萝卜泥？
Rtheguy
Strawberries are actually native to Europe. The modern variaties are based on hybrids from South America. The native European species were edible though and were eaten. Many fruits were present in Europe. The Romans spread grapes and likely apples and pears. Brambles and raspberries, currants and many more are naturally found in European woods. Quinces, medlars etc. also grew. Many of these can be stored or dried quite well.
（荷）草莓实际上是原产于欧洲的。而现代的变种是在南美洲的杂交品种基础上培育出来的。但欧洲的原生品种是可以食用的，在过去也是会吃的。在过去，很多水果欧洲都有。罗马人把葡萄传播到了各地，可能也传播了苹果和梨。在欧洲的树林中能找到自然生长的树莓、覆盆子、醋栗和其他很多水果。榅桲（木梨）、欧楂果等也有生长。其中有很多种都能很妥善地储存或制成果干。
Strawberries are actually native to Europe. The modern variaties are based on hybrids from South America. The native European species were edible though and were eaten. Many fruits were present in Europe. The Romans spread grapes and likely apples and pears. Brambles and raspberries, currants and many more are naturally found in European woods. Quinces, medlars etc. also grew. Many of these can be stored or dried quite well.
（荷）草莓实际上是原产于欧洲的。而现代的变种是在南美洲的杂交品种基础上培育出来的。但欧洲的原生品种是可以食用的，在过去也是会吃的。在过去，很多水果欧洲都有。罗马人把葡萄传播到了各地，可能也传播了苹果和梨。在欧洲的树林中能找到自然生长的树莓、覆盆子、醋栗和其他很多水果。榅桲（木梨）、欧楂果等也有生长。其中有很多种都能很妥善地储存或制成果干。
Cabbage, onions, peas and broadbeans, beets, many radish like plants, other greens, carrots and relatives of them are also all native and were eaten in some capacity. Many common garden weeds are native to Europe and edible. Dandelions, stinging nettles etc.
卷心菜、洋葱、豌豆和蚕豆、甜菜、很多类似水萝卜的植物、其他绿色蔬菜、胡萝卜及其亲戚也全都是原生品种，并在某种程度上被食用。很多常见的庭园杂草都是欧洲本土的，也可以食用。蒲公英、刺荨麻等等。
卷心菜、洋葱、豌豆和蚕豆、甜菜、很多类似水萝卜的植物、其他绿色蔬菜、胡萝卜及其亲戚也全都是原生品种，并在某种程度上被食用。很多常见的庭园杂草都是欧洲本土的，也可以食用。蒲公英、刺荨麻等等。
The native European species were edible though and were eaten.
I mean they're still super popular, they grow wild and are pretty small, but super tasty.
（回，德）“但欧洲的原生品种是可以食用的，在过去也是会吃的。”
我的意思是它们仍然是超级流行的，它们在野外生长，相当小，但超级美味。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
I mean they're still super popular, they grow wild and are pretty small, but super tasty.
（回，德）“但欧洲的原生品种是可以食用的，在过去也是会吃的。”
我的意思是它们仍然是超级流行的，它们在野外生长，相当小，但超级美味。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Plus all the grains! Wheat, barley,rye, oats. Flaxseeds for oils. Various nuts like walnuts and hazelnuts, plus chestnuts (some of these also thanks to the Romans). Egg. Dairy products like cheese and (butter)milk and butter. Different types of meat.
（回，荷）还有很多种谷物！小麦、大麦、黑麦、燕麦。亚麻籽，榨油用。各种坚果，比如核桃和榛子，还有栗子（其中一些品种也要归功于罗马人）。鸡蛋。奶制品，比如奶酪和酪乳和黄油。各种类型的肉。
（回，荷）还有很多种谷物！小麦、大麦、黑麦、燕麦。亚麻籽，榨油用。各种坚果，比如核桃和榛子，还有栗子（其中一些品种也要归功于罗马人）。鸡蛋。奶制品，比如奶酪和酪乳和黄油。各种类型的肉。
To add to this: a much bigger variety of grains was used in those times, things like spelt, buckwheat and millet. All those things got killed by the potato and corn as they have a much bigger yield. The sad thing being that those "archaic" grains have more useful nutritients than potatoes and corn, especially proteins. They are making a comeback though, as a healthier alternative.
（回，塞尔维亚）补充一点：在那个时代使用的谷物种类远多于现在，比如斯佩尔特小麦、荞麦和小米。所有这些都被土豆和玉米扼杀了，因为这两个的产量大得多。可悲的是，这些“古老”的谷物中含有的有益营养成分比土豆和玉米还要多，特别是蛋白质。不过它们正在卷土重来，成为了一种更健康的替代选项。
（回，塞尔维亚）补充一点：在那个时代使用的谷物种类远多于现在，比如斯佩尔特小麦、荞麦和小米。所有这些都被土豆和玉米扼杀了，因为这两个的产量大得多。可悲的是，这些“古老”的谷物中含有的有益营养成分比土豆和玉米还要多，特别是蛋白质。不过它们正在卷土重来，成为了一种更健康的替代选项。
They're getting pretty popular again
（回，丹）它们又开始盛行了
（回，丹）它们又开始盛行了
Corn and potato have okay nutrient content, lots of amino acids for corn and vitamin c for potato. That's not really true of high fructose corn syrup and potato chips though.
（回）玉米和土豆的营养成分还算可以，玉米中含有很多氨基酸，土豆则含有维生素C。但高果糖玉米糖浆和薯片就不是如此了。
（回）玉米和土豆的营养成分还算可以，玉米中含有很多氨基酸，土豆则含有维生素C。但高果糖玉米糖浆和薯片就不是如此了。
was about to say like, potatoes are incredibly nutritious, it's sad that in some circles they apparently have a bad rep for "being unhealthy". This is, after all, the plant that ended famines in Central Europe.
（回，德）我刚还想说土豆的营养价值极其高，但遗憾的是，在某些圈子里，土豆显然因其“不健康”而声名狼藉。毕竟，这是终结了中欧饥荒的植物。
（回，德）我刚还想说土豆的营养价值极其高，但遗憾的是，在某些圈子里，土豆显然因其“不健康”而声名狼藉。毕竟，这是终结了中欧饥荒的植物。
If you want to live on two things potatoes and milk provides most nutrients.
（回，瑞典）如果你想靠两样东西存活，那么土豆和牛奶可以提供大部分的营养。
（回，瑞典）如果你想靠两样东西存活，那么土豆和牛奶可以提供大部分的营养。
Buckwheat is super popular in Russia. AFAIK French consider it bird food.
（回，俄）荞麦在俄罗斯极受欢迎。但据我所知，在法国人看来它是鸟食。
（回，俄）荞麦在俄罗斯极受欢迎。但据我所知，在法国人看来它是鸟食。
Potatoes are quite good nutrition-wise (as a starch, etc), but then you have to eat the skin to get the full complement of minerals.
（回，德）土豆的营养相当好（从一种含淀粉食物的角度看），但你必须把皮吃了才能获得其所有的矿物质。
（回，德）土豆的营养相当好（从一种含淀粉食物的角度看），但你必须把皮吃了才能获得其所有的矿物质。
Who eats corn in Europe? I though it was mainly food for pigs. I very likely eat less than 5 corn sticks per year.
（回，法）在欧洲谁会去吃玉米啊？我以前觉得它主要是用来喂猪的。我每年吃掉的玉米棒可能还不足五根。
（回，法）在欧洲谁会去吃玉米啊？我以前觉得它主要是用来喂猪的。我每年吃掉的玉米棒可能还不足五根。
In large parts of Europe, corn was indeed mostly grown as livestock fodder. It grows here, but not quite as well as in hotter climates of Central America and even North America. Of course, southern Europe does better for corn, so that's where you'll find it. As the other poster commented, in Romania and Italy for example. But even then, it has long been considered embarrassing "poor people" food.
（回，德）在欧洲的大部分地区，种玉米大都是为了当成牲畜饲料来用，这是实情。它在我们这里也是能长出来的，但长得不如在中美洲甚至北美洲那种炎热气候中那么好。当然，南欧的玉米种植发展得更好，所以你会在那里找到它。正如其他跟帖所言，比如在罗马尼亚和意大利。但即便如此，长期以来它也一直被认为是让人难堪的“穷人”食物。
（回，德）在欧洲的大部分地区，种玉米大都是为了当成牲畜饲料来用，这是实情。它在我们这里也是能长出来的，但长得不如在中美洲甚至北美洲那种炎热气候中那么好。当然，南欧的玉米种植发展得更好，所以你会在那里找到它。正如其他跟帖所言，比如在罗马尼亚和意大利。但即便如此，长期以来它也一直被认为是让人难堪的“穷人”食物。
Eating corn "directly" (not via livestock flesh) is a lot more common in the Americas, and also Africa (as maize, same thing though).
I (Candian here) grew up eating corn and love it. That Europeans don't and consider it cheap pig food or biomass fuel is a bit sad. But it's OK, lots of other things to eat too.
“直接”吃玉米（而不是通过牲畜的肉）在美洲和非洲（那里的叫法是maize（玉米），虽然是一回事）更为常见。
我这个加拿大人是吃着玉米长大的，而且很喜欢吃。欧洲人不喜欢吃，认为它是廉价的猪食或生物质能燃料，这有点可悲。但是没关系，也有很多其他东西可以吃。
I (Candian here) grew up eating corn and love it. That Europeans don't and consider it cheap pig food or biomass fuel is a bit sad. But it's OK, lots of other things to eat too.
“直接”吃玉米（而不是通过牲畜的肉）在美洲和非洲（那里的叫法是maize（玉米），虽然是一回事）更为常见。
我这个加拿大人是吃着玉米长大的，而且很喜欢吃。欧洲人不喜欢吃，认为它是廉价的猪食或生物质能燃料，这有点可悲。但是没关系，也有很多其他东西可以吃。
Actually corn/maize is not popular in Europe at all, compared to other grains. It’s mostly used to feed animals.
（回）事实上，和其他谷物相比，玉米在欧洲完全不受欢迎。它的主要用途是喂养动物。
（回）事实上，和其他谷物相比，玉米在欧洲完全不受欢迎。它的主要用途是喂养动物。
bel_esprit_
Chestnuts also are native to the Americas. North America used to be completely covered in chestnut trees until the blight (an invasive fungus from China) took them all out.
栗子也是原产于美洲的。从前的北美遍地都是栗子树，直到枯萎病（一种来自中国的侵袭性真菌）把它们都消灭了。
Chestnuts also are native to the Americas. North America used to be completely covered in chestnut trees until the blight (an invasive fungus from China) took them all out.
栗子也是原产于美洲的。从前的北美遍地都是栗子树，直到枯萎病（一种来自中国的侵袭性真菌）把它们都消灭了。
Late 1800s to mid 1900s. We had over a billion chestnut trees. They were everywhere and a very beloved tree by both Native Americans and European immigrants. So many streets in the US are called “Chestnut”, yet there are none anymore. It’s heartbreaking and stupid what happened to them.
Most younger Americans don’t know or think about them anymore, but they were a beautiful and legendary tree.
It was a big lesson and why we shouldn’t allow invasive species into our countries.
（回）十九世纪末至二十世纪中期。我们有超过十亿棵栗子树。它们无处不在，是很受美洲原住民和欧洲移民青睐的树木。在美国有很多街道被称为“栗子街”，但如今不再有了。它们的遭遇让人心碎，也特别愚蠢。
大部分年轻美国人不知道它们，或是不会再想起它们，但它们是一种美丽且富有传奇色彩的树。
这是个惨痛的教训，提醒着我们为什么我们不应该允许入侵物种进入我们的国家。
Most younger Americans don’t know or think about them anymore, but they were a beautiful and legendary tree.
It was a big lesson and why we shouldn’t allow invasive species into our countries.
（回）十九世纪末至二十世纪中期。我们有超过十亿棵栗子树。它们无处不在，是很受美洲原住民和欧洲移民青睐的树木。在美国有很多街道被称为“栗子街”，但如今不再有了。它们的遭遇让人心碎，也特别愚蠢。
大部分年轻美国人不知道它们，或是不会再想起它们，但它们是一种美丽且富有传奇色彩的树。
这是个惨痛的教训，提醒着我们为什么我们不应该允许入侵物种进入我们的国家。
Slusny_Cizinec
There are tons of beans native to Eurasia. Peas (pisum sativum), chickpeas (cicer arietinum), broad bean (vicia faba), lentil (lens culinaris), lupin (lupinus albus). These are european/middle eastern/north african ones, and still eaten today. I am not counting plants from China.
（捷克）有海量的豆类都是原产于欧亚大陆的。豌豆，鹰嘴豆，蚕豆，扁豆，羽扇豆。这些都是欧洲/中东/北非的原生物种，直到今天仍然被食用。我还没有计算来自中国的植物呢。
There are tons of beans native to Eurasia. Peas (pisum sativum), chickpeas (cicer arietinum), broad bean (vicia faba), lentil (lens culinaris), lupin (lupinus albus). These are european/middle eastern/north african ones, and still eaten today. I am not counting plants from China.
（捷克）有海量的豆类都是原产于欧亚大陆的。豌豆，鹰嘴豆，蚕豆，扁豆，羽扇豆。这些都是欧洲/中东/北非的原生物种，直到今天仍然被食用。我还没有计算来自中国的植物呢。
Of course gruels from barley, oats, rye, emmer, millet, spelt were a staple food for poor people. Cereals provide carbs, beans provide proteins. For fats, flax, hemp, sesame, olive (whenever possible) was used.
And of course genus Brassica was widely used: not only cabbage, but also turnip (brassica rapa) and rutabaga (brassica napobrassica).
当然了，用大麦、燕麦、黑麦、小米、斯佩尔特小麦制成的稀粥是穷人的主食。谷类能提供碳水化合物，豆类能提供蛋白质。（可食用的）植物油方面，以前人们使用的是亚麻、大麻、芝麻、橄榄（只要有可能）。
当然了，芸苔属植物也被广泛食用：不仅有卷心菜，还有芜菁和芜菁甘蓝。
And of course genus Brassica was widely used: not only cabbage, but also turnip (brassica rapa) and rutabaga (brassica napobrassica).
当然了，用大麦、燕麦、黑麦、小米、斯佩尔特小麦制成的稀粥是穷人的主食。谷类能提供碳水化合物，豆类能提供蛋白质。（可食用的）植物油方面，以前人们使用的是亚麻、大麻、芝麻、橄榄（只要有可能）。
当然了，芸苔属植物也被广泛食用：不仅有卷心菜，还有芜菁和芜菁甘蓝。
ViolettaHunter
We know a lot about cuisines before that. People ate lots of bread and grain porridges and vegetables that people today have barely heard of, like turnips, which are very tasty but potatoes give more energy, so they've become a fringe vegetable.
（德）我们非常了解现代之前的菜肴。人们会吃很多面包和杂粮粥，还有今天的人们几乎没听说过的蔬菜，比如萝卜，它非常美味，但土豆能提供更多的能量，所以萝卜已经变成了一种非主流蔬菜。
We know a lot about cuisines before that. People ate lots of bread and grain porridges and vegetables that people today have barely heard of, like turnips, which are very tasty but potatoes give more energy, so they've become a fringe vegetable.
（德）我们非常了解现代之前的菜肴。人们会吃很多面包和杂粮粥，还有今天的人们几乎没听说过的蔬菜，比如萝卜，它非常美味，但土豆能提供更多的能量，所以萝卜已经变成了一种非主流蔬菜。
And btw, think about what native Americans ate before Europeans came.
Pigs, cows, chickens... all of them came from Europe. They had no milk, no cheese, no eggs and practically no domestic animals for meat.
顺便一提，想想看在欧洲人到来之前，美洲原住民吃的是什么？
猪、牛、鸡...这些全都来自欧洲。他们没有牛奶，没有奶酪，没有鸡蛋，也几乎没有用来提供肉的家畜。
Pigs, cows, chickens... all of them came from Europe. They had no milk, no cheese, no eggs and practically no domestic animals for meat.
顺便一提，想想看在欧洲人到来之前，美洲原住民吃的是什么？
猪、牛、鸡...这些全都来自欧洲。他们没有牛奶，没有奶酪，没有鸡蛋，也几乎没有用来提供肉的家畜。
Lots of venison and bison and rabbits in North America. Guinea pigs and llamas in South America. And fish, both on the coast and lakes/rivers. Plus potatoes, tomatoes, corn and pumpkins. I think they did just fine over there prior to the introduction of domesticated animals.
And in Mesoamerica, Tenochtitlan, the Aztec empire, was arguably the greatest market for foodstuffs in the entire world in its heyday.
（回）北美洲有很多鹿肉、野牛肉和兔肉。南美洲则有豚鼠和美洲驼（即大羊驼）。还有鱼，海岸和湖泊/河流里都有。还有土豆、番茄、玉米和南瓜。我认为在引入驯化动物之前，他们在那里活得很好。
在中美洲，阿兹特克帝国的特诺奇蒂特兰城在其全盛时期可以说是全世界最大的食品市场。
And in Mesoamerica, Tenochtitlan, the Aztec empire, was arguably the greatest market for foodstuffs in the entire world in its heyday.
（回）北美洲有很多鹿肉、野牛肉和兔肉。南美洲则有豚鼠和美洲驼（即大羊驼）。还有鱼，海岸和湖泊/河流里都有。还有土豆、番茄、玉米和南瓜。我认为在引入驯化动物之前，他们在那里活得很好。
在中美洲，阿兹特克帝国的特诺奇蒂特兰城在其全盛时期可以说是全世界最大的食品市场。
Sometimes I wonder how a simple 'Brotzeit' could be the one dish that is more or less unchanged since the middle ages.
Bread, cheese, cured meat, milk based spreads, Radi, Horseradish are all stuff that where known to Europeans in the middle ages.
And just to add: I'm not sure if I found it mentioned already, but don't forget pumpkin calabash (sorry, same name in german) , that was already known during the middle ages and quite popular! I'm not quite sure what climate it needs to grow, at least in Austria it is and was grown a lot. As a bonus it hardly needs any upkeep compared to other vegetables since its leaves just cover all the weeds.
（回，奥地利）有时我会琢磨，一道简单的“Brotzeit”怎么就成了自中世纪以来几乎没有发生过变化的一道菜。
面包、奶酪、腌肉、牛奶酱、萝卜、辣根都是欧洲人在中世纪就已经了解的东西。
还要补充的是：我不确定别人有否提过，但不要忘了葫芦形南瓜（抱歉，在德语中是同一个名字），它在中世纪已经为人所知了，而且很受欢迎！我不太清楚它在哪种气候下才能生长，至少在奥地利，现在和过去都种过很多。另外，和其他蔬菜相比，它几乎不需要打理，因为它的叶子直接把所有杂草给覆盖了。
Bread, cheese, cured meat, milk based spreads, Radi, Horseradish are all stuff that where known to Europeans in the middle ages.
And just to add: I'm not sure if I found it mentioned already, but don't forget pumpkin calabash (sorry, same name in german) , that was already known during the middle ages and quite popular! I'm not quite sure what climate it needs to grow, at least in Austria it is and was grown a lot. As a bonus it hardly needs any upkeep compared to other vegetables since its leaves just cover all the weeds.
（回，奥地利）有时我会琢磨，一道简单的“Brotzeit”怎么就成了自中世纪以来几乎没有发生过变化的一道菜。
面包、奶酪、腌肉、牛奶酱、萝卜、辣根都是欧洲人在中世纪就已经了解的东西。
还要补充的是：我不确定别人有否提过，但不要忘了葫芦形南瓜（抱歉，在德语中是同一个名字），它在中世纪已经为人所知了，而且很受欢迎！我不太清楚它在哪种气候下才能生长，至少在奥地利，现在和过去都种过很多。另外，和其他蔬菜相比，它几乎不需要打理，因为它的叶子直接把所有杂草给覆盖了。
（图为Brotzeit为原产自南德的传统餐点）
Ereine
I think that in Finland they ate a lot of porridge and rye bread and turnips were super important. They also apparently ate a lot of salted herring, at least in more coastal areas. At least according to what I remember about a book of Finnish food history. Porridge is useful for soaking the herring so that it becomes softer.
（芬）我认为在过去的芬兰，他们吃大量的粥和黑麦面包，而萝卜也有着非常重要的地位。显然，他们也大量吃腌鲱鱼，至少在更靠近海岸的地区是如此。至少，根据我记忆中的某本讲芬兰食品史的书，是这样的。粥可以用来浸泡鲱鱼，使其变得更软。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
I think that in Finland they ate a lot of porridge and rye bread and turnips were super important. They also apparently ate a lot of salted herring, at least in more coastal areas. At least according to what I remember about a book of Finnish food history. Porridge is useful for soaking the herring so that it becomes softer.
（芬）我认为在过去的芬兰，他们吃大量的粥和黑麦面包，而萝卜也有着非常重要的地位。显然，他们也大量吃腌鲱鱼，至少在更靠近海岸的地区是如此。至少，根据我记忆中的某本讲芬兰食品史的书，是这样的。粥可以用来浸泡鲱鱼，使其变得更软。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Before the 18th century Finns diet was pretty simple:
在十八世纪以前，芬兰人的饮食是相当简单的。
在十八世纪以前，芬兰人的饮食是相当简单的。
Grain: oat, rye, barley
Vegetables: Turnip, swede, cabbage, carrot, onion, peas, beans
Berries: lingonberry, bilberry, cranberry, wild strawberry, raspberry, arctic bramble, stone bramble, sea-buckthorn, cloudberry, rowan,
Dairy: butter, buttermilk, cheese
Protein: pork, cow, small game, deer, elk, bear, seal, fish, chicken eggs, wild bird eggs
Spices: juniper, caraway, marjoram, chives, meadowsweet, tansy, field mint, hops, pot marigold, parsley, horseradish, estragon, lovage, rosemary, dill, garlic, garden angelica
（回，芬）谷物：燕麦、黑麦、大麦
蔬菜：萝卜、瑞典甘蓝、卷心菜、胡萝卜、洋葱、豌豆、各种豆类
浆果：越橘、山桑子、蔓越莓、野草莓、覆盆子、北极树莓、石生悬钩子、沙棘、北欧醋栗、云莓、花楸果
乳制品：黄油、酪乳、奶酪
蛋白质：猪肉、牛、小型猎物、鹿、麋鹿、熊、海豹、鱼、鸡蛋、野鸟蛋
香料：杜松、葛缕子、马郁兰、细香葱、绣线菊、艾菊、薄荷、啤酒花、金盏菊、欧芹、辣根、龙蒿、独活草、迷迭香、莳萝、大蒜、园当归
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Vegetables: Turnip, swede, cabbage, carrot, onion, peas, beans
Berries: lingonberry, bilberry, cranberry, wild strawberry, raspberry, arctic bramble, stone bramble, sea-buckthorn, cloudberry, rowan,
Dairy: butter, buttermilk, cheese
Protein: pork, cow, small game, deer, elk, bear, seal, fish, chicken eggs, wild bird eggs
Spices: juniper, caraway, marjoram, chives, meadowsweet, tansy, field mint, hops, pot marigold, parsley, horseradish, estragon, lovage, rosemary, dill, garlic, garden angelica
（回，芬）谷物：燕麦、黑麦、大麦
蔬菜：萝卜、瑞典甘蓝、卷心菜、胡萝卜、洋葱、豌豆、各种豆类
浆果：越橘、山桑子、蔓越莓、野草莓、覆盆子、北极树莓、石生悬钩子、沙棘、北欧醋栗、云莓、花楸果
乳制品：黄油、酪乳、奶酪
蛋白质：猪肉、牛、小型猎物、鹿、麋鹿、熊、海豹、鱼、鸡蛋、野鸟蛋
香料：杜松、葛缕子、马郁兰、细香葱、绣线菊、艾菊、薄荷、啤酒花、金盏菊、欧芹、辣根、龙蒿、独活草、迷迭香、莳萝、大蒜、园当归
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
TonyGaze
Hello, trained historian here, who worked extensively with the medi era. So, what did old-timey people eat?
（丹）你好，我是训练有素的历史学家，针对中世纪开展过广泛的研究工作。那么，旧时代的人都吃什么呢？
Hello, trained historian here, who worked extensively with the medi era. So, what did old-timey people eat?
（丹）你好，我是训练有素的历史学家，针对中世纪开展过广泛的研究工作。那么，旧时代的人都吃什么呢？
In Denmark, we're mainly talking about a diet without much meat. Only the richest nobles could afford to eat meat dishes every day, and for the vast majority of the population, meat-focused dishes was a luxury, largely reserved the major holidays, such as Christmas and Easter. Ofc. meat was eaten, but not in the same style and context as today. It was mainly dried, smoked, or preserved in other ways. It wasn't a fresh roast or piece of steak. Contrary to nowadays, beef and mutton was, for a long time, the main eating animal in Denmark, before pork took over, pork being regarded as a luxury in medi times. Poultry wasn't really viable, not even for the richest, outside of special occasions. The only widely available meat, was fish. Particularly herring, which the Danish belts floweth over with, so much so that the main income for the Danish state for a long time, was taxing the Scanian herring-markets. When the small silver suckers stupidly migrated through Øresund, you could practically pick them out of the water with your bare hands.
在丹麦，我们主谈的含肉量很少的饮食。每天都吃得起肉的只有最有钱的贵族，而对于绝大多数人来说，以肉为重点的菜肴是一种奢侈，大都要留到重大节日才吃，比如圣诞节和复活节。当然了，也是会吃肉的，但不同于今天的吃法和用餐环境。主要是做成肉干，熏制，或以其他方式保存。不会是鲜肉烧烤或是一块牛排。和现在相反，在被猪肉取代以前，牛羊肉在很长一段时间内都是丹麦的主要食用动物，猪肉在中世纪被视为奢侈品。而家禽不太能养活，即使是最富有的人也是如此，在特殊场合中也是没有的。唯一可以随处获得的肉类是鱼。特别是鲱鱼，丹麦人肚子里的鲱鱼多到溢出，以至于在很长一段时间里，丹麦政府的主要收入是对斯堪尼亚鲱鱼市场征的税。当这些银色的小蠢物在迁徙过程中穿过厄勒海峡时，你几乎可以空手把它们从水里捞出来。
在丹麦，我们主谈的含肉量很少的饮食。每天都吃得起肉的只有最有钱的贵族，而对于绝大多数人来说，以肉为重点的菜肴是一种奢侈，大都要留到重大节日才吃，比如圣诞节和复活节。当然了，也是会吃肉的，但不同于今天的吃法和用餐环境。主要是做成肉干，熏制，或以其他方式保存。不会是鲜肉烧烤或是一块牛排。和现在相反，在被猪肉取代以前，牛羊肉在很长一段时间内都是丹麦的主要食用动物，猪肉在中世纪被视为奢侈品。而家禽不太能养活，即使是最富有的人也是如此，在特殊场合中也是没有的。唯一可以随处获得的肉类是鱼。特别是鲱鱼，丹麦人肚子里的鲱鱼多到溢出，以至于在很长一段时间里，丹麦政府的主要收入是对斯堪尼亚鲱鱼市场征的税。当这些银色的小蠢物在迁徙过程中穿过厄勒海峡时，你几乎可以空手把它们从水里捞出来。
So, if meat was off the table, bar at holidays, what else did people eat? Ofc. fish, but also porridge from barley, or oats if you were fancy.
The first price however, was cabbage. Cabbage was so important in medi Danish cuisine, that the oldest Danish word for garden is kålgård, meaning "cabbage plot." Peas were also extremely important to Danish cuisine, in multiple forms, but not the modern green ones, most people think of... Mainly the hard yellow and grey ones, that were dried and needed to be boiled or stewed for a long time to be edible.
那么，如果餐桌上没有肉（节假日除外），人们还吃什么？当然是鱼，但也有大麦粥，或者燕麦粥，如果你很喜欢的话。
然而，地位最高的还是卷心菜。卷心菜在中世纪的丹麦菜中太重要了，以至于丹麦最古老的对应“花园”的词是kålgård，意思是“卷心菜地”。豌豆在丹麦菜中也极为重要，有好几种形态，但不是大多数人认为的那几种绿色的现代豌豆。主要是很硬的黄色、灰色豌豆，而且是脱水的，需要煮或炖很长时间才能吃。
The first price however, was cabbage. Cabbage was so important in medi Danish cuisine, that the oldest Danish word for garden is kålgård, meaning "cabbage plot." Peas were also extremely important to Danish cuisine, in multiple forms, but not the modern green ones, most people think of... Mainly the hard yellow and grey ones, that were dried and needed to be boiled or stewed for a long time to be edible.
那么，如果餐桌上没有肉（节假日除外），人们还吃什么？当然是鱼，但也有大麦粥，或者燕麦粥，如果你很喜欢的话。
然而，地位最高的还是卷心菜。卷心菜在中世纪的丹麦菜中太重要了，以至于丹麦最古老的对应“花园”的词是kålgård，意思是“卷心菜地”。豌豆在丹麦菜中也极为重要，有好几种形态，但不是大多数人认为的那几种绿色的现代豌豆。主要是很硬的黄色、灰色豌豆，而且是脱水的，需要煮或炖很长时间才能吃。
Ofc. there was also things like bread and such.
Onion and garlic were known to be used as sources of flavour, since spices weren't a thing most people had access to.
Various fruits, apples and plums and such, were also popular, particularly the apple, with many of even the poorest farms having an apple tree.
当然，也有面包之类的东西。
大家都知道，洋葱和大蒜被用作调味品，因为大多数人是无法获得香料的。
各种水果、苹果和李子等等也很受欢迎，特别是苹果，连很多最穷的农场也有一棵苹果树。
Onion and garlic were known to be used as sources of flavour, since spices weren't a thing most people had access to.
Various fruits, apples and plums and such, were also popular, particularly the apple, with many of even the poorest farms having an apple tree.
当然，也有面包之类的东西。
大家都知道，洋葱和大蒜被用作调味品，因为大多数人是无法获得香料的。
各种水果、苹果和李子等等也很受欢迎，特别是苹果，连很多最穷的农场也有一棵苹果树。
One thing I heard was that particularly in cities, people would raise pigs as "living trash cans", feeding them with all sorts pf scraps. There's an idiom in German, "die Sau rauslassen" – "to let the sow out", which means to party without restraint, and it apparently goes back to people letting their pigs out onto (closed off segments of) the street, where they would eat all the garbage and possibly excrements that were out there.
（回，德）我听说的一件事是：人们会把猪当成“活的垃圾桶”来养，用各种残羹剩饭喂它们，特别是在城市里。在德语中有一个成语，“die Sau rauslassen（把母猪放出来）"，意思是放纵地狂欢，这显然可以追溯到人们把猪放到（封闭的某几段）街上，在那里它们会吃掉所有的垃圾，可能还会吃排泄物。
（回，德）我听说的一件事是：人们会把猪当成“活的垃圾桶”来养，用各种残羹剩饭喂它们，特别是在城市里。在德语中有一个成语，“die Sau rauslassen（把母猪放出来）"，意思是放纵地狂欢，这显然可以追溯到人们把猪放到（封闭的某几段）街上，在那里它们会吃掉所有的垃圾，可能还会吃排泄物。
Essentially, the pigs provided the service of getting rid of all sorts of scraps and things people wouldn't eat, and a relatively easy source of meat for city folk.
本质上看，猪提供了处理掉各种剩饭废料和人不吃的东西的服务，并为城市居民提供了相对容易取得的肉类。
本质上看，猪提供了处理掉各种剩饭废料和人不吃的东西的服务，并为城市居民提供了相对容易取得的肉类。
probably stemming from 19th century livestyles, but a Dutch chef described the pig as the savior of many farmers. A pig can be fed table scraps and while it is not up to modern animal welfare standards at all kept quite well in just a garden shed or walled of corner. Even a relatively poor farmer could feed one up and have a lot of meat and sausages for winter and sausages, hams and bacons keep very well if conserved.
（回，荷）这可能源于十九世纪的生活方式，但一位荷兰厨师将猪描述为很多农民的救星。用餐桌上的残羹剩饭就能养活一头猪，虽然这完全达不到现代动物的福利标准，只需花园里的一个棚子或是有围墙的角落就能养得很好。即使是相对贫穷的农民也能把一头猪养肥，而且能有大量的肉和香肠用来过冬，而香肠、火腿和熏肉如果保存得当，肉质也会保持得很好。
（回，荷）这可能源于十九世纪的生活方式，但一位荷兰厨师将猪描述为很多农民的救星。用餐桌上的残羹剩饭就能养活一头猪，虽然这完全达不到现代动物的福利标准，只需花园里的一个棚子或是有围墙的角落就能养得很好。即使是相对贫穷的农民也能把一头猪养肥，而且能有大量的肉和香肠用来过冬，而香肠、火腿和熏肉如果保存得当，肉质也会保持得很好。
I remember reading somewhere that one of Polish chronical writters once wrote that Danes ate blood sausages. He was scandalized and disgusted. Funny, because now they are part of our classic cuisine. Lol
（回，波）我记得在哪里读到过，一位波兰的编年史作家曾写道，丹麦人吃血肠。这让他感到震惊和恶心。有趣的是，现在它们成了我们经典菜肴的一部分呵呵
（回，波）我记得在哪里读到过，一位波兰的编年史作家曾写道，丹麦人吃血肠。这让他感到震惊和恶心。有趣的是，现在它们成了我们经典菜肴的一部分呵呵
OrderUnclear
The Colombian exchange actually brought more food to the Americas than the other way around. Apples, wheat, sheep, cattle, bananas, honey bees, rice, etc...
事实上，哥伦布大交换给美洲带去的食物更多，而不是相反。苹果、小麦、绵羊、家牛、香蕉、蜜蜂、大米等等。
The Colombian exchange actually brought more food to the Americas than the other way around. Apples, wheat, sheep, cattle, bananas, honey bees, rice, etc...
事实上，哥伦布大交换给美洲带去的食物更多，而不是相反。苹果、小麦、绵羊、家牛、香蕉、蜜蜂、大米等等。
Klapperatismus
Most people ate porridge made from barley and/or rye. Three times a day.
（德）大多数人吃的是大麦和/或黑麦制成的粥。顿顿如此。
Most people ate porridge made from barley and/or rye. Three times a day.
（德）大多数人吃的是大麦和/或黑麦制成的粥。顿顿如此。
zgido_syldg
Before the discovery of America, the Italian diet had not changed much since Roman times, people ate mainly bread, soups and polenta (made with cereals and logically not with corn). The staple foods were vegetables and legumes. New plants were introduced by the Arabs in the Middle Ages: cane sugar, almonds, rice, mulberries, aubergines and citrus fruits. Pasta was already widespread. Fish was a poor food, or limited to the period of Lent. Meat was very expensive, there was chicken, but the most consumed was always pork. In inland areas, olive oil was not used for frying (available only in warmer areas) but lard was used (and this has remained until recent times). Eggs, milk, dairy products and herbs were also common.
（意）在发现美洲之前，意大利人的饮食自罗马时代以来没有什么大变，人们主要吃面包、汤和意式玉米粥（用各种谷物制作，从逻辑上讲不是用玉米）。主食是蔬菜和豆类。中世纪时，阿拉伯人引进了新的植物：蔗糖、杏仁、大米、桑葚、茄子和柑橘类水果。意大利面已经很普遍了。鱼是穷人的食物，或是只在大斋期吃。肉类非常昂贵，有鸡肉，但吃最多的始终是猪肉。在内陆地区，橄榄油不作煎炸之用（只有较温暖的地区才能获得），而是使用猪油（该做法一直保留到近代）。鸡蛋、牛奶、乳制品和草药也很常见。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Before the discovery of America, the Italian diet had not changed much since Roman times, people ate mainly bread, soups and polenta (made with cereals and logically not with corn). The staple foods were vegetables and legumes. New plants were introduced by the Arabs in the Middle Ages: cane sugar, almonds, rice, mulberries, aubergines and citrus fruits. Pasta was already widespread. Fish was a poor food, or limited to the period of Lent. Meat was very expensive, there was chicken, but the most consumed was always pork. In inland areas, olive oil was not used for frying (available only in warmer areas) but lard was used (and this has remained until recent times). Eggs, milk, dairy products and herbs were also common.
（意）在发现美洲之前，意大利人的饮食自罗马时代以来没有什么大变，人们主要吃面包、汤和意式玉米粥（用各种谷物制作，从逻辑上讲不是用玉米）。主食是蔬菜和豆类。中世纪时，阿拉伯人引进了新的植物：蔗糖、杏仁、大米、桑葚、茄子和柑橘类水果。意大利面已经很普遍了。鱼是穷人的食物，或是只在大斋期吃。肉类非常昂贵，有鸡肉，但吃最多的始终是猪肉。在内陆地区，橄榄油不作煎炸之用（只有较温暖的地区才能获得），而是使用猪油（该做法一直保留到近代）。鸡蛋、牛奶、乳制品和草药也很常见。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
artaig
In southern Europe dry meat and fish, desiccated with salt. Jamón, chorizo, bacallau, are typical in Spain and Portugal. You had a slaughter (matanza) once a year and preserve the meat until next year.
Salt was then a very important commodity, hence the name salary (payment in salt).
（西班牙）在南欧，是肉干和鱼，用盐腌制。西班牙火腿、西班牙辣香肠、腌鳕鱼在西班牙和葡萄牙是很有代表性的。每年都会进行一次屠宰（译注：matanza即杀猪/做杀猪菜的屠宰节），会把肉保存到来年。
当时盐（sal）是一种非常重要的商品，也是工资（salary）这个词（以盐支付）的由来。
In southern Europe dry meat and fish, desiccated with salt. Jamón, chorizo, bacallau, are typical in Spain and Portugal. You had a slaughter (matanza) once a year and preserve the meat until next year.
Salt was then a very important commodity, hence the name salary (payment in salt).
（西班牙）在南欧，是肉干和鱼，用盐腌制。西班牙火腿、西班牙辣香肠、腌鳕鱼在西班牙和葡萄牙是很有代表性的。每年都会进行一次屠宰（译注：matanza即杀猪/做杀猪菜的屠宰节），会把肉保存到来年。
当时盐（sal）是一种非常重要的商品，也是工资（salary）这个词（以盐支付）的由来。
Poultry and eggs available all year. Eggs are so important to trade that English took the name from the Danes they traded with.
Not only engineering came from the Middle East, mostly Persia, but also plenty of fruits and legumes, which were first cultivated in Persian gardens (paradaisos): apples, appricots, melons,... all taken by the Romans and spread to Europe.
In remote "uncivilized" areas, less quantity of fruits was compensated with nuts, specially chestnuts, also introduced by the Romans to feed their legions in Western Europe (except some tiny areas where it was already present).
And then of course, the mother of all food, wheat/bread, with other cereals and vegetables.
一年四季都有家禽和鸡蛋。鸡蛋对贸易非常重要，以至于英国人是从和他们贸易的丹麦人那里拿来了这个名字的（译注：丹麦语中鸡蛋为æg）。
不仅工程学来自中东地区（主要是波斯），还有大量的水果和豆类也是从那里来的，它们最早是在波斯人的花园里栽培的：苹果、杏、甜瓜...都被罗马人拿来传播到欧洲了。
在偏远的“未开化”地区，坚果弥补了量较少的水果，特别是栗子，栗子也是罗马人引入的，当时是为了喂饱他们在西欧地区的军团（除了一些已经存在栗子的小地区）。
当然，还有食物之母小麦/面包，以及其他谷类和蔬菜。
Not only engineering came from the Middle East, mostly Persia, but also plenty of fruits and legumes, which were first cultivated in Persian gardens (paradaisos): apples, appricots, melons,... all taken by the Romans and spread to Europe.
In remote "uncivilized" areas, less quantity of fruits was compensated with nuts, specially chestnuts, also introduced by the Romans to feed their legions in Western Europe (except some tiny areas where it was already present).
And then of course, the mother of all food, wheat/bread, with other cereals and vegetables.
一年四季都有家禽和鸡蛋。鸡蛋对贸易非常重要，以至于英国人是从和他们贸易的丹麦人那里拿来了这个名字的（译注：丹麦语中鸡蛋为æg）。
不仅工程学来自中东地区（主要是波斯），还有大量的水果和豆类也是从那里来的，它们最早是在波斯人的花园里栽培的：苹果、杏、甜瓜...都被罗马人拿来传播到欧洲了。
在偏远的“未开化”地区，坚果弥补了量较少的水果，特别是栗子，栗子也是罗马人引入的，当时是为了喂饱他们在西欧地区的军团（除了一些已经存在栗子的小地区）。
当然，还有食物之母小麦/面包，以及其他谷类和蔬菜。
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