古代中国知道亚历山大大帝和他的征服吗,两者相遇会发生什么?
2023-05-31 吕洞宾! 14647
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Western Decline Follow
The vast majority of Chinese people do not know about Alexander the Great.
The ancient Chinese didn't even know about Alexander the Great.
Zhang Qian - Wikipedia
Zhang Qian, the envoy of the Han Dynasty, had never heard of Alexander the Great when he went to Central Asia in 140-115 BC.
The farthest place Zhang Qian went to was Afghanistan, which means that the influence of Alexander the Great did not reach Afghanistan.
During the Han Dynasty, China had contact with Iran, and had never heard of Alexander the Great.
Therefore, when Chinese people know the story of Alexander the Great, they feel very strange, because ancient Chinese will definitely record the history of other countries.
Possibly, the influence of Alexander the Great was infinitely exaggerated by the West.
Maybe Alexander the Great conquered some countries, but not as much as the West advertised, and the impact on other countries was not as great.
If the Chinese have never heard of Alexander the Great, it means that there is no influence in the East.

绝大多数中国人都不知道亚历山大。
古代中国人甚至不知道亚历山大大帝是谁。
张骞-维基百科
汉朝使臣张骞在公元前140-115年出使中亚时,还没听说过亚历山大。
张骞去过的最远的地方是阿富汗,这就意味着亚历山大的影响力并没有到达阿富汗。
汉代时,中国与伊朗也有过接触,但从未听说过亚历山大。
因此,当中国人知道亚历山大的故事时,他们感到很奇怪,因为中国古人肯定会记载其他国家的历史。
很有可能,亚历山大大帝的影响力被西方无限地夸大了...
也许亚历山大征服了一些国家,但没有西方国家宣传的那么多,对其他国家的影响也没有那么大。
如果中国人从来没有听说过亚历山大,那就意味着他在东方没有什么影响力。

To be honest, this is not the first time the West has faked history.
Countries around China often make up a hero, but Chinese history books have never recorded it.
Besides, the ancient West did not even have paper, and there was no systematic historical record at all.
According to Chinese standards, before paper was popularized, the history of most countries was a fairy tale.
The smallest country recorded by Zhang Qian has only a few thousand people. If Zhang Qian really heard of a great hero, he must have recorded it.
It shows that the local people don't know Alexander at all.

说实话,这已经不是西方第一次伪造历史了。
中国周边的国家经常虚构英雄人物,但中国的史书从未有过记载。
此外,古代西方甚至没有纸张,也根本没有系统的历史记录。
按照中国人的标准,在纸普及之前,大多数国家的历史都是童话故事。
张骞记载的最小的国家只有几千人。如果张骞真的听说过一个伟大的英雄,他一定已经记录下来了。
这表明当地人根本不认识亚历山大。

Feng Xian Follow
Nope.
Alexander the Great’s conquest in the East took place during the period of Warring States. They didn’t have the means to realize the existence of Alexander the Great.
Maybe the Qiang and Huns would receive the news of the arrival of Greeks and deliver that to Qin which was closer to the Western border. But there is no record on if this happened or not.

不知道。
亚历山大征服东方是发生在中国战国时期,那时的中国人没有办法意识到亚历山大的存在。
也许羌人、匈奴人会收到希腊人到来的消息,并将消息传递给更靠近古代中国西部边境的秦国。但目前还没有关于这件事是否发生过的记录。

Jiahong Chen Follow
No, because they were lack of touch. The royalties of Qin and Han were more focusing on their own business.
Emperor Qin Shihuang were busy about conquering the other six states. After his conquest, he was busy of doing other things like building the Great Wall etc..
Even the rulers of Han Dynasty were not aware the existance of them. If there were people who were aware, then probably would be Guangdong People, I have been to the Museum twice, first time I was a kid, without any knowledge of history. The second time I has been grown up, and with knowledge about it.
As the museum has shown, Guangdong had been contact with the Middle East by then during the Spring and Autumn Period, so by the time the people in Guangdong might have the chance to be aware of the conquest of Alexander. But Guangdong was not in the Middle Kingdoms yet.

不,是因为他们缺乏接触。秦汉两朝的统治者们更注重自己的事业。
秦始皇忙于征服其他六国。征服后,他忙着做其他事情,比如修建长城等。
即使是汉朝的统治者也不知道他们的存在。如果有古代中国人可能知道的话,那最有可能是古代的广东人,我去过两次那里的博物馆,第一次是在我还是个孩子的时候,我对历史一无所知。第二次我已经长大了,并且对历史有了一定了解。
正如博物馆所呈现的那样,广东在春秋时期就与中东取得了联系,所以那时的广东人最有可能知道亚历山大的征服事迹。但是那时的广东还没有融入中原。

Sean Landy Follow
Technically Alexander was great, but not so famous in China.
I mean his conquested land were not bigger than China’s own “core land”.
The far distance of his conquesting were not longer than travel distance between China’s provinces.
Chinese recorded a city named “Alexander” in center Aisan, it became an independ country before Alexander die.
Some Greece people still lived there during Han dynasty, they kept their own Alexander style troops.
And this country refused selling good horses to China, so the Han dynasty government send army there and do battles and change their King.
BTW, Chinese old native wild horse looks like this:
And those center Aisan horse looks like this:
It is said during the battle, the Alexander style troops in those city took rebellion against the old King, they captured the old King and deal with Han Army.
And then Han dynasty got their horse and until now we still call those kind of horse as Heaven horses.
There is still a Heaven Horses ceremony every year in China.
So beautiful creatures.
Thank you Mr.Alexander.

从技术上来讲,亚历山大很伟大,但他在中国并不是那么出名。
我的意思是,他征服的土地并不比中国自己的“核心土地”大。
他征服的距离也并不比中国各省之间的旅行距离长。
据中国人记载,在中亚有一座名为“亚历山大”的城市,在亚历山大去世之前成为了一个独立的国家。
一部分希腊人在汉朝时仍然住在那里,他们保留着亚历山大式的军队。
由于这个国家拒绝向中国出售好马,所以汉朝政府派军队去攻打这个国家并替换了他们的国王。
顺便说一句,中国本土以前的野马长这样:
那匹中间的马是这样的:
据说在这场战争中,那个中亚国家的亚历山大式军队在城中叛变了老国王,他们俘虏了老国王并投靠了汉军。
自此汉朝有了他们的马,直到现在我们还称这种马为天马。
在中国,每年仍然都有一个庆祝天马的仪式。
如此美丽的生物。
谢谢你,亚历山大先生。

Martin Fox Follow
No. He got past the Indus River, but his conquests stalled in India. In 326 BCE Alexander's army mutinied at the Beas River (they called it the Hyphasis) in what is today Punjab, India, rather than invade the Ganges Valley, which was controlled by the Nanda Empire. So, Alexander never fought the Chinese, and it is unlikely that he encountered them.
Alexander had founded the city of Alexandria Eschate ("Alexandria the Farthest") in 329 BCE, in the Furghana Valley of what is now Tajikistan. The Hellenistic descendants of these settlers probably were the first people of European descent to encounter the Chinese around 220 BCE. This contact, with the efforts of the Chinese Han dynasty, led to the development of the Silk Road in the next century.

没有。他越过了印度河,但他的征服在印度就停滞了。公元前326年,亚历山大的军队在今天印度旁遮普的比亚斯河(他们称之为希法西斯河)叛变,而不是入侵由南达帝国控制的恒河流域。所以,亚历山大从来没有和中国人打过仗,也不太可能遇到他们。
亚历山大于公元前329年在现在的塔吉克斯坦的富尔加纳山谷建立了亚历山大埃斯切特城(“最远的亚历山大”)。这些移民的希腊化后裔可能是公元前220年左右第一批遇到中国人的欧洲人。这种联系,随着中国汉朝的努力,促就了丝绸之路在下一个世纪的发展。

原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Praveen Bhardwa Follow
He suffered a humiliating defeat at the hands of the Indian King Porus, contrary to what is written in popular European History books to perpetuate the myth of Greatness of Alexander the Ordinary.
Following will clarify -
In the Ethiopic texts, Mr E.A.W. Badge has included an account of "The Life and Exploits of Alexander" where he writes inter alia the following:
"In the battle of Jhelum a large majority of Alexander`s cavalry was killed. Alexander realized that if he were to continue fighting he would be completely ruined. He requested Porus to stop fighting. Porus was true to Indian traditions and did not kill the surrendered enemy. After this both signed treaty, Alexander then helped him in annexing other territories to his kingdom".
Mr Badge further writes that the soldiers of Alexander were grief- stricken and they began to bewail the loss of their compatriots. They threw off their weapons. They expressed their strong desire to surrender. They had no desire to fight. Alexander asked them to give up fighting and himself said, "Porus, please pardon me. I have realized your bravery and strength. Now I cannot bear these agonies. WIth a sad heart I am planning to put an end to my life. I do not desire that my soldiers should also be ruined like me. I am that culprit who has thrust them into the jaw of death. It does not become a king to thrust his soldiers into the jaws of death."
These expressions of `Alexander, The Great!` do not indicate from any stretch of imagination his victory over Porus? Can such words be uttered by a `World Conquerer"?

他在印度国王波罗斯的手下遭受了耻辱的失败,这与欧洲历史中广泛流传的凡人亚历山大的伟大神话截然相反。
以下为澄清:
在埃塞俄比亚的资料文本中,E.A.W. Badge先生收录了一篇关于“亚历山大的生平和功绩”的文章,其中他特别写道:
“在耶赫勒姆战役中,亚历山大的大部分骑兵阵亡。亚历山大意识到,如果他继续战斗,他将彻底完蛋。他请求波罗斯停止战斗。波罗斯忠于印度传统,没有杀死投降的敌人。在双方签署了条约之后,亚历山大帮助他吞并了其他领土。”
巴奇先生进一步写道,亚历山大的士兵们悲痛无比,他们开始为失去同胞而悲伤,他们丢掉了武器,他们表达了投降的强烈愿望,他们没有了战斗的欲望。亚历山大要求他们放弃战斗,他自己是这么说的:“,请原谅我。我体会到了你的勇敢和力量。现在我无法忍受这些痛苦,带着一颗悲伤的心,我正计划结束我的生命。我不希望我的士兵也像我一样被毁灭,否则我就是把他们推入死亡深渊的罪魁祸首。把他的士兵推入死亡的深渊,这不是一个国王的作风。”
这些标榜“亚历山大伟大!”的任何想象中有那些表明他曾战胜了波罗斯吗? 那些是“世界征服者”能说出的话吗?

I am sure many readers will find in the history texts, an account of Alexander`s exploits and conquests which totally contradict what is quoted above. And most of us have been taught in the school that Alexander defeated Porus and he wept because he had no more worlds to conquer, and that is what made him `Alexander, The Great`. These myths and beliefs will receive a rude shock by these facts which show that Alexander was not that great after all, but in fact he was `Alexander, The Ordinary`.
Another myth is propagated by the Western historians that Alexander was noble and kind king, he had great respects for brave and courageous men, and so on. The truth is other-wise. He was neither a noble man nor did he have a heart of gold. He had meted out very cruel and harsh treatment to his earlier enemies. Basus of Bactria fought tooth and nail with Alexander to defend the freedom of his motherland. When he was brought before Alexander as a prisoner, Alexander ordered his servants to whip him and then cut off his nose and ears. He then killed him. Many Persian generals were killed by him.
The murder of Kalasthenese, nephew of Aristotle, was committed by Alexander because he criticised Alexander for foolishly imitating the Persian emperors. Alexander also murdered his friend Clytus in anger. His father`s trusted lieutenant Parmenian was also murdered by Alexander. The Indian soldiers who were returning from Masanga were most atrociously murdered by Alexander in the dead of night. These exploits do not prove Alexander`s kindness and greatness, but only an ordinary emperor driven by the zeal of expanding his empire.

我相信许多读者会在历史文本中发现,亚历山大的功绩和征服的描述与上面引用的完全矛盾。我们大多数人在学校里都被教导说亚历山大打败了波罗斯,还说他因为没有更多的世界可以征服而哭泣,这就是他被称为亚历山大大帝的原因。这些神话和信仰将受到这些事实的粗暴冲击,这些事实表明亚历山大根本不是那么伟大,事实上他只是“平凡的亚历山大”罢了。
另一个神话是由西方历史学家传播的,亚历山大是一个高贵而善良的国王,他非常尊重勇敢和勇武的人等等。但事实并非如此,他既不是一个高贵的人,也没有一颗金子般的心。他对他以前的敌人采取了非常残酷和严厉的态度。巴克特里亚的巴苏斯为了保卫祖国的自由与亚历山大进行了激烈的战斗,当他作为囚犯被带到亚历山大面前时,亚历山大命令仆人鞭打他,然后割下他的鼻子和耳朵,然后又杀了他。许多波斯将军被他杀死了。
亚历山大谋杀了亚里士多德的侄子卡拉斯提尼塞,因为他批评亚历山大愚蠢地模仿波斯皇帝。亚历山大还在愤怒中谋杀了他的朋友克吕托斯,他父亲信任的将军帕尔米尼亚也被亚历山大谋杀了。从马桑加回来的印度士兵在夜深人静时被亚历山大残忍地杀害了。这些功绩并不能证明亚历山大的仁慈和伟大,它们只是一个普通的皇帝在扩张帝国的热情驱使下取得的。

原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Hieu Trung Follow
Of course not.
Though conquerring Persia, Alexander’s army was a tiny one, numbered only at 40,000- 50,000 men in comparison with army of any Chinese Warring states at that time. At that time, every Warring state of China, especially State of Qin was highly militarized (you can compare that with states like Prussia, Mongols, or Nazi Germany later, where the ratio of number of men in standing army out of population of were huge). Large states like Qin, Qi, Chu, Zhao and Wei can field an army of 300,000 men for a single battle, and had a standing army of more than 600,000 men. Not just having a huge numerical advantage, their armies were well-disciplined, battle-hardened due to constant military conflicts among themselves and with nomadic tribes in the north like Xiongnu and Donghu, and technologically advanced in comparison to their contemporaries, equipped with cross-bows, calvary and chariots, which were like tanks in ancient warfare. Their commanders were also excellent in military strategies and tactics thanks to the intensive learning of Art of Wars by Sun-tzu, and many among them were masters in art of war themselves such as: Sun Bin (of Qi), Bai Qi (of Qin). Not to mention Chinese rugged terrain, which was suitable for setting up ambushes, which could lead to quick destruction of Alexander’s tiny army if he ventured into China.
In fact, Alexander was lucky that his empire was mountains away from China, otherwise, military conflicts with China would for sure spell his demise.

当然不是。
虽然征服了波斯,但亚历山大的军队规模很小,哪怕与当时中国战国时期任何一个国家的军队相比,它只有4 - 5万人。当时,中国的每个战国,尤其是秦国都高度军事化(你可以将其与普鲁士、蒙古或后来的纳粹德国等国家进行比较,这些国家的常备军人数占总人口的比例非常大)。秦国、齐国、楚国、赵国、魏国这样的大国,一仗就能派出30万人的军队,常备军也有60多万人。他们的军队不仅拥有巨大的数量优势,而且纪律严明,由于内部以及与匈奴和东胡等北方游牧部落的不断军事冲突,他们的军队久经沙场,与同时代的其他国家的军队相比,他们的技术先进,配备了弩、战车(就像古代战争中的坦克一样)。由于对孙子兵法的深入学习,他们的将领在军事战略和战术上也很出色,其中许多人本身就是兵法大师,如: 孙膑(齐国),白起(秦国)。更不用说中国崎岖不平的地形,适合设置伏击,如果亚历山大冒险进入中国,这可能会导致他的小军队迅速被摧毁。
事实上,亚历山大很幸运,他的帝国与中国远隔重洋,否则,与中国的军事冲突肯定会导致他的灭亡。

Nav Follow
Definitely not because to conquer China there is only 2 route either go from the central Asian route or first reach modern day Bangladesh (or seven sister areas which is controled by the country of India) and then go North. Let's discuss each route
The central Asian route is very tough because the region is very cold and harsh.
The Bangladeshi region is very tough because the region has a lot of forest and the it is very humid.
To conquer China Alexander needs to conquer whole of India first or at least conquer India in South till Deccan region and conquer Nanda empire in the east( because if not the nadas and the local rules of the subcontinent would pose a threat to his empire when he would be busy on the campaign of China). Conquering India would be very tough and even if Alexander beat the odds and conquers India which would likely take him 5 to 10 years conquer India.
I don't think Alexander soldiers would support him to conquer China because in our world conquering West India itself they mutined against him. Conquering whole of India and + conquering of China would be highly impossible because soldiers will not agree.

当然没有,因为要征服中国只有两条路线,要么从中亚路线出发,要么先到达现代孟加拉国(或由印度控制的七个姐妹地区),然后向北走。我们来讨论一下每条路线:
中亚路线非常艰难,因为该地区非常寒冷,环境非常恶劣。
孟加拉国那个地区也非常难走,因为该地区有很多森林,而且非常潮湿。
为了征服中国,亚历山大需要首先征服整个印度,或者至少征服印度南部直到德干地区,并征服东部的南达帝国(因为如果不能征服南达和印度次大陆的其他小国,当他忙于与中国的战争时,它们将对他的帝国构成威胁)。征服印度将是非常困难的,即使亚历山大战胜了一切困难,征服印度也可能需要5到10年的时间。
我不认为亚历山大的士兵会支持他征服中国,因为在他们征服西印度的期间里,他们背叛了他。征服整个印度和征服中国是绝不可能的,因为士兵们不会同意的。

Even if his soldiers did agree to conquer whole of India and China the route to go to China with an army would be tough because of the rough climate.
Let's say some how Alexander won China that wouldn't mean China would be the part of Alexander's empire for long term because of the great distance between Babylon and China. The Chinese region would always break into revolts and even India might also revolt against the Alexander

即使他的士兵同意跟随他征服整个印度和中国,由于恶劣的气候,带着军队去中国的路线也会很难走。
让我们说一下亚历山大即使赢得了中国会怎么样,这并不意味着中国将长期成为亚历山大帝国的一部分,因为巴比伦和中国之间距离遥远。中国地区将不断爆发叛乱,甚至印度也可能会反抗亚历山大王朝。

Liu Lisong Follow
Of course.we know him as we attach great importance to history, whether it is domestic or foreign.
But the Chinese have no special opinion about Alexander. There are two reasons, one of which is that his empire is too short-lived. Although the many remains still existed after the collapse of the Macedonian Empire, as another story.
More importantly, in the Chinese values, Alexander does not deserve the title of "the Great" He is just a young man, a military genius, a conqueror. His empire is huge, yes, so what? What the Chinese respect is not the conqueror, but also the builder.
In Chinese history, the greatest emperor is not only the most outstanding military strategist, but also an excellent governor. The second emperor of the Tang Dynasty, Li Shimin the great, was the representative of it. In the war of unifying an empire of 10 million square kilometers, he never lost a battle. His army crossed the Pamirs,the Yalu and the Mekong River. His authority reached the Kamchatka, Baikal and Afghanistan. I believe that such military achievements are no worse than Alexander.

当然,我们知道他,因为我们非常重视历史,无论是国内的还是外国的。
但是中国人对亚历山大并没有什么特别的看法。有两个原因,其中之一是他的帝国太短暂了。虽然许多遗迹在马其顿帝国崩溃后仍然存在,但那是另一个故事。
更重要的是,在中国人的价值观中,亚历山大配不上“伟大”的称号,他只是一个年轻人,一个军事天才,一个征服者。他的帝国很大,没错,那又怎样? 中国人尊敬的不是征服者,而是建设者。
在中国历史上,最伟大的皇帝不仅是最杰出的军事家,而且还得是一个优秀的统治者。唐朝的第二个皇帝,李世民大帝就是代表人物。在征服一千万平方公里土地的帝国扩张战争中,他从未输过一场仗。他的军队越过了帕米尔高原、鸭绿江和湄公河。他的势力遍及堪察加、贝加尔湖和阿富汗。我相信这样的军事成就并不比亚历山大差。
However, after his passing away, he was honored as the "文皇帝", meaning that he has a more outstanding performance in governing the country, restoring the economy, and improving the people's living standards. He improved the imperial examination system to sext all professionals with professional skills, reduce taxes to farmers and encourage business development. Under the rule of the emperor, China landed on the top of the world for the third time.The surrounding countries call the emperor as Khan of Heaven.And China has since become the Celestial Empire.

Of course, I don't think that Alexander the Great has no merits to govern the country, but at least he has not shown outstanding talents and achievements on this. The Chinese do not think that he is different from other war machines. Even think that this is a tyrannical person, excessive use of force.

然而,在他去世后,他被尊称为“文皇帝”,意思是他在治理国家、恢复经济和提高人民生活水平方面有更突出的表现。他改进了科举制度,选拔所有有专业技能的人才,减少农民的税收,鼓励商业发展。在这个皇帝的统治下,中国第三次登上了世界之巅。周边国家称这位皇帝为“天可汗”,中国从此成为了天朝帝国。
当然,我并不认为亚历山大大帝没有治理国家的优点,但至少他在这方面没有表现出突出的才能和成就。中国人并不认为他和其他战争狂人有什么不同,甚至会认为这是一个暴虐的人,因为他过度使用武力。

David Farnsworth Follow
I do not know what the Chinese thought of Alexander the Great. But I do know that they had a word for Greece, and I suspect that this came up because of an association with Alexander. Naturally, this word was later applied to the Roman Empire, so that by the Han dynasty it had come to mean “that big empire way out west somewhere”.
Back in the 1990s, I read this strange tale (written in the 1950s) by some historian that there was a village deep in NW China that had been settled by Roman legionnaires. He claimed this by saying that the old name for this village used the character for Greece (see above), and then opined that what must’ve happened is a Roman legion associated with Crassus had got trounced by the Persians, captured en-masse, and then later used as mercenaries by the Persians for warfare somewhere in Central Asia, and were AGAIN trounced by a Han Chinese army operating far to the west, and taken en-masse to China, where they were mustered out, settled down, married Chinese girls, etc.
I don’t know what to make of this story, but maybe its plausible…
Then a few years later, I was amused to read that someone in that village had heard about the historians’ speculations, decided it was true, got the village to build a fake Roman arch, and sat back to wait for the tourist dollars!

我不知道中国人是怎么看亚历山大大帝的。但我确实知道他们有一个叫“希腊”的词,我怀疑这是因为与亚历山大的联系。自然,这个词后来被用来形容罗马帝国,所以到了汉朝,它的意思就变成了“那个远在西部的大帝国”。
早在上世纪90年代,我就读到某个历史学家写的一个奇怪的故事(写于上世纪50年代),说在中国西北深处有一个村庄,那里住着罗马军团士兵。他声称说,这个村子的老名称字符是用希腊文书写的,然后认为,这可能是一个罗马军团在与波斯的战争中战败,他们被成群结队地俘虏了,然后作为战争雇佣军被波斯人用于在中亚和汉人军队作战,但是被再次击败了,然后被带回了中国,在那里,他们集中起来定居了下来并娶了中国女孩等等。
我不知道该怎么理解这个故事,但也许它是可信的……
几年后,我读到村里有人听说了历史学家的猜测,认为这是真的,于是让村里建造了一座假的罗马拱门,然后坐下来等着游客们的钱!

Ash Leeway Follow
I don’t think it was ever mentioned in ancient Chinese chronicles except a few city states named after him. The ancient Chinese probably didn’t pay him any attention.
I don’t know what ancient Chinese would’ve thought. A modern Chinese who knows Alexander would probably regard him in the same light as how Westerners viewed great Chinese generals or Middle Eastern scientists—an ubiquitous respect without much special reverence, since their direct impact is not felt.
I personally thought that it would be interesting if Alexander can somehow conquer China (well-nigh impossible, but…). Despite what nationalists might say I think it has the potential to be greatly beneficial. In the time of Alexander, the Qin Dynasty was on the rise, and unfortunately China’s first taste of unification was not so great as it birthed a tyrannical and despotic rule which became somewhat a recurring motif in China’s political history. Since Alexander is a relatively more lenient statesman and would bring about trade routes with new ideas, technology and merchandise, I think it would’ve been at most a great historical turn for China, who otherwise usually lacked contact with the majority of powerhouse nations in the rest of the world. Or maybe vanquishing Qin will be too great a loss to China’s overall militia power to defend itself from northern threats, but at least give rise to less self-centred and tolerant state(s) that can rule China better than Ying Zheng.

我想除了一些以他命名的城邦外,中国古代的史书上没有提到过他。古代中国人可能没有注意到他。
我不知道古代中国人会怎么想。一个了解亚历山大的现代中国人可能会像西方人看待伟大的中国将军或中东科学家一样看待他——一种无处不在的尊重,而不是特别的崇敬,因为他们没有直接的影响。
我个人认为如果亚历山大能以某种方式征服中国会很有趣(虽然几乎不可能,但是…)。尽管民族主义者可能会说,我认为它有可能是非常有益的。在亚历山大时代,秦朝正在崛起,不幸的是,中国第一次尝到的统一的滋味并没有那么伟大,因为它催生了一个专制和集权的统治,这在某种程度上这成为中国政治史上反复出现的主题。由于亚历山大是一个奉行相对宽松统治的政治家,他将带来新的思想、技术和商品的贸易路线,我认为这对中国来说是一个伟大的历史转折,否则中国通常情况下与世界上其他大多数强国都缺乏联系。或者也许征服秦国对中国整体的军事力量来说是一个巨大的损失,他们将无法抵御北方的威胁,但至少会产生一个不那么以自我为中心且宽容的国家,这可以比嬴政的方式更好地统治中国。

原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Chao Tong Follow
First, ignoring logistics problems, because that problem in itself would result in Alexander failing to even reach China.
Assuming adequate logistics, it would still absolutely be impossible for Alexander to conquer China. Why? Because the only opponents that Alexander ever faced were Darius and Porus, Darius in particular kept gaving Alexander battles that he mastered due to his own incompetance.
There are in general three types of formations in ancient wars.
1.A lack of formation. This is the most elementary type. It involves soldiers charging enemies in a human wave.
2.Forming into units of 100 men or so. This was the Macedonian phalanx. It could decisively beat Persian troops due to strong organisation and the inability of Persian cavalry to penetrate it with direct charges, but lacked mobility and versatility in many cases.
3.Forming units of 5 to 10 men. This was the tactic used both by China and the Rome. Notice that Roman armies often had very little difficulty against Macedonian phalanxes in the Macedonian wars. China, ever since Wu Qi’s reforms in the 6th centruy BCE used this type of formation in wars. This is pretty much the army organisational method used by the Mongols later on and still used in most wars today, dividing command into units starting from around 5 or 10.

首先,忽视后勤问题,因为后勤问题本身就会导致亚历山大连中国都打不到。
假设有足够的后勤保障,亚历山大征服中国仍然是绝对不可能的。为什么? 因为亚历山大面对的唯一对手是大流士和波鲁斯,特别是大流士,由于他自己的无能,他一直给亚历山大发挥他擅长的战斗方式的机会。
古代战争的阵型一般有三种。
1.缺乏队形。这是最基本的类型。它包括士兵向敌人发起人力波攻击。
2.以100人为单位,这是马其顿方阵。由于强大的组织使波斯骑兵无法用直接冲锋穿透,它可以决定性地击败波斯军队,但在许多情况下缺乏机动性和通用性。
3.以5至10人为一组,这是中国和罗马都使用的策略。请注意,在马其顿战争中,罗马军队在对付马其顿方阵时往往没有遇到什么困难。自公元前6世纪吴起改革以来,中国在战争中都使用这种阵型。这就是后来蒙古人使用的军队组织方法,并且在今天的大多数战争中仍然使用,将指挥单位分为5或10人一个单位。

Around the time of 320 BCE in China, Shang Yang had just transformed Qin, the westernmost state into a military state capable of mobalising more than 1/5 of its population for war and producing extremely high quality equipment; King Wuling had made Zhao the military superpower of the north with his Hufu Qishe policy of adopting steppe cavalry as the main offensive force; Yan had just gained Yue Yi as a general, who was one of the strongest officers of the entire warring states era; Yan was a rising power that about two decades in the future would unite much of eastern China; and Chu was a long established power capable of taking on either Qin or Zhao.
All of these states had adopted the military reforms of Wu Qi, which would make their basic fighting ability on par with Roman soldiers. That is, considering if Alexander were even capable of reaching Qin without running out of manpower or being defeated by nomadic tribes along the way。

For those who can read Chinese, if Alexander had even attempted to invade China, you might see a note in Records of the Grand Historian, Records of Qin, Duke Huiwen Section: 十四年,有馬戎者烏弋山離,東征身毒而盡收之,又圖中國,然瀚海絕之,戎軍屢越而乏之。至境,乃余萬甲。惠文君曰:「區爾數矛,安可問鼎乎?」伐之,克,戎軍走。烏弋山離暴疾而死,以其年中早夭,謚悼。
大约在公元前320年的中国,商鞅刚刚把秦国这个古代中国最西端的国家变成了一个军事大国,它能够动员超过全国五分之一的人口参加战争,并生产出非常高质量的武器装备; 赵武灵王以草原骑兵为主力的胡服骑射政策,使赵国成为北方的军事强国;燕国刚刚得到了乐毅将军,乐毅是战国时代最强大的将领之一; 燕国是一个正在崛起的大国,在未来的20年里,它将统一中国东部的大部分地区; 楚国是一个久负盛名的强国,既能与秦国较量,也能与赵国较量。
所有这些国家都采用了吴起的军事改革,使他们的基本作战能力与罗马士兵不相上下。也就是说,这甚至不考虑亚历山大是否有能力到达秦国而不耗尽人力或被沿途的游牧部落击败。
对于那些能读懂中文的人来说,如果亚历山大曾经试图入侵中国,你可能会在《史记》-秦本纪-秦惠文王列传一节中看到这样的记载: 十四年,有馬戎者烏弋山離,東征身毒而盡收之,又圖中國,然瀚海絕之,戎軍屢越而乏之。至境,乃余萬甲。惠文君曰:「區爾數矛,安可問鼎乎?」伐之,克,戎軍走。烏弋山離暴疾而死,以其年中早夭,謚悼。

Vinte Rutab Follow
"Ridiculously, the Chinese are the highest-ethnic people in the world. Who invented gunpowder, muskets, artillery, mines, mines, rockets, grenades? Are all China.
you can search List of Chinese inventions at wiki
Westerners are just nouveau riche, stealing Chinese inventions, stealing compasses, water tanks only to sail to discover the Americas, stealing gunpowder, muskets, artillery to win the indigenous, stealing papermaking printing to overthrow religious rule, stealing hydraulic textile machines To gain wealth, but when the king has woke up, the dance of the clown will end immediately and the world will be back on track.

真是荒谬,中国人是世界上地位最高的民族。谁发明了火药、火枪、火炮、地雷、火箭、手榴弹? 都是中国。
你可以在维基上搜索中国发明列表
西方人只是暴发户,偷中国的发明,偷指南针、水箱只为航海发现美洲;偷火药、火枪、大炮只为征服土著;偷造纸印刷术只为推翻宗教统治;偷液压纺织机只为获取财富。但当国王醒来时,小丑的舞蹈将立即结束,世界将回到正轨。

Don't forget that Europeans have always been the weakest, poor, and pause ethnic group in Eurasia. The nomads who were expelled by China ran to Europe to bully you. The Huns expelled from the Han Dynasty destroyed West Rome and the Turks expelled from the Tang Dynasty. People destroyed the East Roman Empire, the Black Death transmitted by the Mongols and even killed a quarter of Europe's population. Both Eastern and Southern Europe are occupied by Mongolian Turkic Arabs until you steal the Chinese invention. Why The scientific and technological foundation of the Industrial Revolution comes from China.but the Industrial Revolution happen in the West? It is because you are too poor, backward, and scattered. After the Ottoman Empire blocked the Silk Road, Europeans like beggars sailed at their own expense and discovered America. The rich will not do these things, Now tell a fact that the American media will never tell you that China's industrial output value is now the sum of the United States, Japan, and Germany, and the number of patent applications each year accounts for 50% of the world. In another two decades, China's industrial output value will be European America Taken together, the number of patent applications each year accounts for 65% of the world's total.The world once again returns to the state before the European Industrial Revolution.After all, in the past 2000, China had the world's first in 1800.Until it was overtaken by Britain 200 years ago,Britain was overtaken by the United States 100 years ago and now we are back"

别忘了,欧洲人一直是欧亚大陆上最弱小、贫穷和停滞的族群。被中国驱逐的游牧民族跑到欧洲却可以随意欺负当地的民族。被汉朝驱逐的匈奴人摧毁了西罗马帝国,被唐朝驱逐的突厥人摧毁了东罗马帝国。突厥人摧毁了东罗马帝国,蒙古人传播的黑死病甚至杀死了欧洲四分之一的人口。东欧和南欧都曾被蒙古人、突厥人、阿拉伯人占领,直到你们偷了中国的发明。为什么工业革命的科技基础来自中国? 但工业革命发生在西方? 那是因为你们太穷,太落后,太分散。在奥斯曼帝国封锁了丝绸之路之后,欧洲人像乞丐一样自费航行,发现了美洲。富人不会做这些事,现在告诉你一个事实,美国媒体永远不会告诉你,中国现在的工业产值是美国、日本和德国的总和,每年的专利申请量占世界的50%。再过二十年,中国的工业产值将超过欧洲和美国,每年的专利申请量将占世界总量的65%。世界将再次回到欧洲工业革命前的状态。毕竟,在过去的2000年,中国有1800年都是世界第一。直到200年前被英国超越,100年前英国被美国超越,但现在我们又回来了。
原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Jihan Parikh Follow
The logistics of invading China would have alone made the conquest impossible. The Achaemanid Empire was a highly decentralised empire. The empire itself was broken into a bunch of satrapies or client states, with their own rulers, known as satraps. These satraps were usually directly appointed by the emperor. The only reason Alexander won was because of this decentralised system. Once Alexander had defeated Darius in a few battles, the satraps began to openly declare their loyalty to Alexander, which weakened Darius further and strengthened Alexander’s army. If the satraps had stayed loyal to Darius, Alexander’s army would have been destroyed by attrition alone. He was struggling to fight India, as his victory at Hydaspes was against a regional governor and not the full force of the Magadha empire. When his men realised that a huge Indian army was waiting across the river, he was forced to turn back and return.

单是入侵中国所需要的后勤补给就足以使征服成为不可能。阿契美尼德帝国是一个高度分散的帝国,帝国本身被分割成一些附属国,它们有自己的统治者,被称为总督。这些总督通常由皇帝直接任命。亚历山大获全胜的唯一原因就是这个去中心化的系统。一旦亚历山大在几次战役中击败了大流士,这些总督们就开始公开宣布他们对亚历山大的忠诚,这进一步削弱了大流士,加强了亚历山大的军队。如果总督们一直忠于大流士,亚历山大的军队就会被消耗殆尽。当他在与印度作战时,他在杰赫勒姆河的胜利是因为他只是在与一个地方总督作战,而不是摩揭陀帝国的全部力量。当他的手下意识到河对岸有一支庞大的印度军队等着他时,他被迫折返了。

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