印度是否应继续作为一个世俗国家?
2024-11-01 不要可乐 4742
正文翻译
V M Sarma Jana
India can remain a secular country provided
1. We respect each religion, on its own beliefs
2. We do not force any conversion, by any means,
3. We apply the same Rules of law to all citizens irrespective of religion, belief, caste creed.
4. Most important, we are Indians first, before asserting our religion.

印度可以继续作为一个世俗国家
1. 我们尊重每个宗教各自的信仰
2. 我们不会以任何方式强迫任何人皈依,
3. 我们对所有公民适用同样的法律规则,不论其宗教、信仰、种姓信仰。
4. 最重要的是,我们首先是印度人,然后才是我们的宗教信仰。

评论翻译
Abu Musa Al Huerera
Depends on what is your definition of Secularism is. In India, for past 50 years Secularism has been misused and misinterpreted by Political parties to suite their ideologies. Asaduddin Owaisi considers himself Secular being a Supremo of Communal party that works for vested interest and to some extent community and religious interest of one section. BJP is anyway tagged as Communal party by all mainstream Media while the same media considers Owaisi Brethren as Seculars and remain mum on their vitriolic speeches. You must be talking about Political Secularism and Not Social Secularism. Truly speaking none of them going to work in India for sure.

这要看你对世俗主义的定义是什么。在印度,过去50年来,世俗主义被政治党派滥用和误解,以适应他们的意识形态。阿萨杜丁·奥瓦伊西自认为是世俗的,但他是一个为特定利益、以及某一社区和宗教利益服务的宗派党的首领。无论如何,BJP被所有主流媒体贴上了宗派党的标签,而同样的媒体却认为欧韦西的支持者是世俗的,并对他们的尖刻言论保持沉默。你说的肯定是政治上的世俗主义,而不是社会上的世俗主义。说实话,这两者在印度都不会真正有效。

After looking at Geo Politics and Geo political history around the world what I feel is that Secularism works very well in countries that are Monolithic Religious but certainly Secularism will always be at stake and misused in Pluralistic societies in India, USA and Europe.

在观察全球地缘政治和地缘政治历史后,我认为世俗主义在单一宗教国家中运作得很好,但在印度、美国和欧洲这样的多元社会中,世俗主义总是会面临风险和被滥用。

Pakistan can become Secular being a Monolithic religious country. Secularism works at its best in Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iran that are purely Islamic countries. Reason is Simple, only in Religious countries you can Isolate Religion and Religious interest from Politics. This doesn’t mean you are entertaining other religions to take over. No.However we totally misunderstood and thus started misinterpreting and misusing secularism.

巴基斯坦作为一个单一宗教国家可以实现世俗化。世俗主义在沙特阿拉伯、也门、伊朗等纯粹伊斯兰国家中表现得最好。原因很简单,只有在宗教国家中,你才能将宗教和宗教利益与政治隔离。这并不意味着你会允许其他宗教主导一切。不是的。然而,我们完全误解了世俗主义,因此开始了对其的误解和滥用。

You opted for La La Land type of Secularism

你选择了类似《梦幻之地》那种的世俗主义。


And here you are paying for such Secularism

而你在为这样的世俗主义付出代价。


Because when you embrace Multi Religious and multi belief denominations into your geopolitical boundaries, it becomes your responsibility and accountability to entertain their religious ideology into your Socio Political sphere. This clearly defies the basic tenets of Secularism to isolate Religion from Politics.
You have two options. Persuade yourself by your emotions and that crude sense of Humanity or Learn from Experiences, History, Events and Evidences. Up to you which side you are on and you pay price accordingly

因为当你在地缘政治边界内包容多宗教和多信仰的教派时,就意味着你有责任和义务将他们的宗教意识形态融入你的社会政治领域。这显然违背了世俗主义的基本原则,即将宗教与政治分开。
你有两个选择。要么被情感和那种粗糙的人道主义所说服,要么从经历、历史、事件和证据中学习。选择哪一方在于你,而你将为此付出代价。

Gopal Sinha
Unity in diversity is a rare beauty and our unique specialty, let us not loose it so easily. Let religion be a personal matter free from government interference, unless and until it creats a law and order problem.

多样性中的团结是一种珍贵的美丽,也是我们独特的特色,让我们不要轻易失去它。让宗教成为个人事务,免于政府干预,除非它造成法律和秩序的问题。

Subash Shukla
India is a Hindu majority country since thousands of years. Can anyone deny this?
Hindus and Hindutva culture and behaviour has been genuinely secular in its real sense. Please do not bite into the secularism theories of the Lutyens media as what they propagate is pseudo variety and is mostly used to indulge into minority appeasement and demeaning and bashing Hindus and their culture and traditions

几千年来,印度一直是印度教占多数的国家。有人能否认这一点吗?
印度教徒和印度教文化和行为在真正意义上是真正世俗的。请不要相信Lutyens媒体的世俗主义理论,因为他们传播的是伪多样性,主要用于沉迷于少数民族的绥绥化,贬低和抨击印度教徒及其文化和传统

Soumyasish Florence Gupta
Government and Religion are two different platforms and need to be separated with clear distinctions. There are individuals who are residents of India that come from various different religious backgrounds and also those who don’t want to be associated with any religion extensively. When Governing authorities are biased towards a specific religion (for eg. hinduism in India), it becomes unfair and lowered in its quality.
Secularization ensures that the highest quality of governance is being contributed to the citizens, with minimum explicit or implicit bias.

政府和宗教是两个不同的平台,需要明确区分并分开。印度有许多来自不同宗教背景的居民,还有一些人不希望与任何宗教有过多关联。当政府当局对某一特定宗教(例如印度的印度教)表现出偏见时,这就变得不公平,影响了治理的质量。
世俗化确保为公民提供最高质量的治理,尽量减少明显或隐性的偏见。

Gopal Sinha
Secularism should be the policy of any society and country today and in our country and culture, it is imbedded since long. It has naturally been our habit, mentality and identity.
However pseudo-secularism as practised by some selfish, hypocrite leaders and self-proclaimed intellectuals is dangerous to our democracy and traditions.

世俗主义应成为当今任何社会和国家的政策,在我们的国家和文化中,它早已根深蒂固。这自然成了我们的习惯、心态和身份。然而,一些自私、虚伪的领导者和自称知识分子所实践的伪世俗主义对我们的民主和传统是危险的。

Hu Shi xiong
Secularism as a state policy involves the state being neutral and fair in it's dealings with the common populace either because you don't want state policies to be retarded by religion if there's a state religion or you have to project fairness since there's more than one practiced or recognised religion .

作为国家政策的世俗主义要求国家在与普通民众的交往中保持中立和公正,原因在于如果存在国家宗教,你不希望国家政策受到宗教的干扰;或者因为有不止一种被认可或实践的宗教,你必须展现公正。

The problem with India in this case is the government services not being trusted to carry out their duties fairly or competently .
The Indian government was noted in several regions they cannot be trusted to carry out duties of protecting her own people within a said community from their own community much less think further at different religions or groups. Just look at the Gulabi Gang or what happened recently in Manipur .

在印度,这个问题在于政府服务未能被信任,无法公正或胜任地履行职责。印度政府在一些地区被认为无法公正地保护某个社区内的人民,更不用说在不同宗教或群体之间进行进一步的考虑。看看“粉红帮”或者最近在曼尼普尔发生的事件。

How and Why
Hindus are the Majority of the country. They allowed the country to be a secular. But misuse of secularism ruined the country. Terrorists were given Biryani in a attack on Hazrat Bal Mosque.In Batala case , Encounter of the terrorists made Sonia Gandhi’s heart broken. But was silent about Hindu killing in train by burning the train. PFI and Terrorists organizations got legal support from secular people. No action has taken in Kasmir. No cries for Hindu killing in Kasmir. It is the story of minority politics over majority politics. Secularism emerged as a weapons against Hindus.

印度教徒是这个国家的主要人口。他们允许这个国家成为一个世俗国家。但是对世俗主义的滥用毁了这个国家。恐怖分子在袭击哈兹拉特巴尔清真寺时得到了比亚尼。在巴塔拉事件中,恐怖分子的遭遇让索尼娅·甘地心碎了。但对印度教徒在火车上被烧死一事保持沉默。PFI和恐怖组织得到了世俗人士的法律支持。在克什米尔没有采取任何行动。不要为在克什米尔杀害印度教徒而哭泣。这是少数人政治战胜多数人政治的故事。世俗主义成为反对印度教徒的武器。

They never said anything in favor of dead in Godhara train incident.They criticized the surgical strike to Pakistan but totally silent of Hindu killing in Kasmir . Indian secular are the peculiar species of the earth. Hindus are by nature secular. India should remain secular if Hindus remain majority .See the countries which are separated from India?Are they secular? Hindu majority means secularism. Our political leaders and parties misusing this against Hindus.

他们从来没有说过任何有利于戈达拉火车事故遇难者的话。他们批评对巴基斯坦的外科手术式打击,但对克什米尔的印度教杀戮完全沉默。印度的世俗是地球上特有的物种。印度教徒天生是世俗的。如果印度教徒仍然占多数,印度应该保持世俗。看看那些从印度分离出来的国家?他们是世俗的吗?印度教占多数意味着世俗主义。我们的政治领导人和政党滥用这一点来对付印度教徒。

Rama G
No. Hinduism says, see God in everything, every one. You yourself a god. You can believe me, need not believe me, follow me, need not follow me. Still, you are a Hindu. You can question, you can search, research, you can refuse, you can accept, still you can be a Hindu.
The major but preferred to be called as minority religion says, our God only is the great. There is no God other than him. Kill the non believers.

不。印度教说,在每件事、每一个人身上看到上帝。你自己就是个神。你可以相信我,不必相信我,跟随我,不必跟随我。你毕竟是印度教徒。你可以质疑,你可以探索,你可以研究,你可以拒绝,你可以接受,你仍然可以是一个印度教徒。
主要的但更愿意被称为少数派的宗教说,我们的上帝是唯一伟大的。除了他以外,再没有别的神了。杀死不信教的人。

This particular religion is very dangerous on earth. Not the mistake of the people who follow it. They are taught and trained like that. Like race horses. Never allowed to use their brains and question back. Just blind folded side ways. So, only can look in to one direction .
Why we have to spend our money, resources on them ? Just to get hurt back? We can use our resources on our development. Let them concentrate on their own welfare.

这个宗教在地球上是非常危险的。而不是追随它的人的错误。他们就是这样被教导和训练的。就像赛马。不允许他们动脑筋,回答问题。只是侧边折了一下。所以,只能朝一个方向看。
为什么我们要把钱和资源花在他们身上?只是为了报复吗?我们可以把资源用于发展。让他们专注于自己的福利吧。

Hinduism doesn't bother about other religions.
Never teach to hate or harm or spread the religion. We are not that bored and busy with our own lives.
Other abrahamic religions are not like that.
It's mandatory for them according to their book to spread, preach about their religion and convert .

印度教不理会其他宗教。
永远不要教导仇恨或伤害或传播宗教。我们对自己的生活并没有那么无聊和忙碌。
其他亚伯拉罕宗教不是这样的。
根据他们的书,他们必须传播,宣讲他们的宗教并皈依。

Some work as distasteful job of salesmen.
People may say, one will follow his heart. What's the problem? He has all the liberty to choose. Good. There should not be any problem.
But, in reality, they tray to brainwash, manipulate, force some times to follow the same like him.
Best example, there is this south Korean singer. Recently converted to Islam. Says, every corner of his country, soon islamic prayers will be heard. How?
What happened to various rich cultures on this earth after Christianity and Islam stepped in? No prizes for guessing.

有些人从事令人讨厌的推销员工作。
人们可能会说,一个人会跟随自己的心。有什么问题吗?他有选择的自由。好。应该不会有什么问题。
但是,在现实中,他们试图洗脑,操纵,强迫一些人像他一样跟随。
最好的例子就是这位韩国歌手。最近皈依伊斯兰教。他说,他的国家的每一个角落,很快就会听到伊斯兰教的祈祷。如何?
基督教和伊斯兰教出现后,地球上各种丰富的文化发生了什么变化?没有猜测的奖品。

Secularism is dangerous to this country in present form.
In all muslim and Christian countries majority rule. Let majority rule here also. Anyway we don't convert or kill minorities like in those countries.
Get rid of this shitty secular term. Bring uniform civil code, impliment CAA,NRC, bring judiciary reforms.
People can practice whatever they believe within law. Not to behave as if they are above law.

以目前的形式,世俗主义对这个国家是危险的。
在所有的穆斯林和基督教国家,多数人统治。这里也让多数决定吧。无论如何,我们不会像那些国家那样改变或杀害少数民族。
去掉这个讨厌的世俗术语。制定统一的民法典,实施民法典、民法典,进行司法改革。
在法律允许的范围内,人们可以做任何他们相信的事情。不要表现得好像他们凌驾于法律之上。

Otherwise, in no time we lose our identity and peace of mind both.
By the way if anyone feels this is not suitable to their ideology, wants to migrate to those countries where their religion is followed, welcome them and arrange the conveyance facilities.
Don't let the camel throwing out the owner out of tent.
People need not beat their chests because all these religions are a forceful entries in to this country. For cheating or looting or invading.

否则,我们很快就会失去我们的身份和内心的平静。
顺便说一下,如果有人觉得这不适合他们的意识形态,想要移民到那些遵循他们宗教的国家,欢迎他们并安排运输设施。
不要让骆驼把主人赶出帐篷。
人们不需要拍胸脯,因为所有这些宗教都是进入这个国家的有力手段。因为欺骗、抢劫或侵略。

原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


People who respect this country and follow rules like all others must be not having any issues. For others who doesn't want to, doors must be open to leave.
No need of have this most cunning and mis used term of secularism. It's really really dangerous to this country ‘s existence. You can't burden one religion to carry all other religions tantrums.

尊重这个国家并像其他人一样遵守规则的人一定没有任何问题。对于那些不想离开的人,门必须开着才能离开。
没有必要使用这个最狡猾和被误用的世俗主义术语。这对这个国家的存在是非常非常危险的。你不能让一个宗教背负所有其他宗教的愤怒。

原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Joaquín Soria Montealegre
India has never been a secular nation in the 1st place…
When people in India debate secularism and communalism they often forget that secularism isn't one well-defined entity. There are three distinct forms of secularism.

印度从来就不是一个世俗国家……当人们在印度讨论世俗主义和宗教主义时,他们常常忽视了世俗主义并不是一个明确的概念。实际上,世俗主义有三种不同的形式。

The form that India has followed allows for differences in laws across religions, especially personal laws. It allows for children to be indoctrinated in religious institutions instead of being educated in schools. It allows for the rights of women to be crushed in the name of religion. It creates a divide between people of different religions through the laws themselves. This is not secularism.

印度所遵循的世俗主义形式允许不同宗教之间存在法律差异,尤其是在个人法方面。它允许孩子在宗教机构中接受洗脑教育,而不是在学校接受教育。它允许以宗教的名义压制女性的权利。它通过法律本身在不同宗教的人之间制造分裂。这不是世俗主义。

If you do not support equal treatment of all citizens under law, you are not secular.
The second form of secularism is what China followed under the rule of Chairman Mao from 1949. The state actively suppressed religion in an attempt to create an atheist, secular state. Though this does lead to equality, it also crushes personal freedom. Secularism of this form would likely not be palatable to most Indians who hold religion as an essential part of their lives.

如果你不支持所有公民在法律面前平等对待,那么你就不是世俗的。第二种世俗主义是中国在1949年毛主席统治下所遵循的。国家积极压制宗教,试图建立一个无神论的世俗国家。尽管这确实导致了平等,但也压制了个人自由。这种形式的世俗主义对大多数认为宗教是生活中重要部分的印度人来说,可能是不可接受的。
原创翻译:龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


The third form of secularism is where the State is neutral in the matter of religion. All people are free to follow whatever religion they want, but laws remain the same for everyone. The state neither promotes nor suppresses any religion. This is what the USA and most European nations adopted and is the predominant form of secularism in the developed world.

第三种世俗主义是国家在宗教事务上保持中立。所有人都可以自由选择自己的宗教,但法律对每个人都一样。国家既不推广也不压制任何宗教。这是美国和大多数欧洲国家所采用的,也是发达国家中占主导地位的世俗主义形式。

If you do not support equal treatment of all citizens under law, if you do not support a secular education designed to inculcate rational thought instead of dogma, if you do not support neutrality of the State and a bar on state funding for any religion, you are not secular.

如果你不支持所有公民在法律面前平等对待,如果你不支持旨在培养理性思维而非教条的世俗教育,如果你不支持国家的中立以及禁止国家资助任何宗教的原则,那么你就不是世俗的。

To be a truly secular State, India must ensure equality under law for all its citizens. It must also stop State funding for all religious purposes and mandate that children are given a proper secular education. If people who claim to be secular also preach special treatment for specific segments of society based on religion they must rethink how India's secular fabric is impacted by this. Do these privileges strengthen Indian society or do they only increase the division in our already polarised society?

要成为一个真正的世俗国家,印度必须确保所有公民在法律面前平等。它还必须停止对所有宗教目的的国家资助,并要求儿童接受适当的世俗教育。如果自称世俗的人还倡导根据宗教对社会特定群体给予特殊待遇,他们就必须重新考虑这一做法对印度世俗结构的影响。这些特权是增强了印度社会,还是只是加剧了我们已经极化的社会的分裂?

AKS
India can't help but remain secular state as long as it is Hindu majority. Hindu relegion by it's very nature professes that God is one and there are many ways to reach out to Him. There is no way a devout Hindu can hate other religions. Although most of the Abrahiminc religions preach that they are the only true relegions and killing or converting non believers especially idolworshippers as a noble deed.

印度在作为一个世俗国家的同时,不能忽视其印度教的大多数地位。印度教本质上宣扬神只有一个,通往神的道路有很多条。一个虔诚的印度教徒不可能仇恨其他宗教。尽管大多数亚伯拉罕宗教宣称自己是唯一的真宗教,并将杀害或转化非信徒,尤其是崇拜偶像者,视为一种崇高的行为。

I know that most of the people will point out the recent surge of bjp to tell that india has changed but it is a very superficial analysis which is made up from feedback from social media. These are not ground reality. Recently I visited Varanasi, holiest of the hindu pilgrimage site, constituency of primeminister modi. What surprised me most was thousands of Muslims staying within a kilometer radius of Vishwanath temple. In holiest of hindu temple they were going through their business as usual without any attempt to conceal their identity. None of them looked like they were feeling threatened. It is a bjp ruled state.

我知道大多数人会指出人民党最近的崛起,说印度已经改变了,但这是一种非常肤浅的分析,是由社交媒体的反馈组成的。这些都不是基础现实。最近我访问了印度最神圣的朝圣地瓦拉纳西,莫迪总理的选区。最让我惊讶的是,成千上万的穆斯林住在维什瓦纳特神庙方圆一公里内。在最神圣的印度教寺庙里,他们像往常一样做生意,没有任何隐瞒自己身份的企图。他们看上去都不像是受到了威胁。这是一个人民党统治的邦。

Yogi Adityanath and Narendra Modi are considered to be most rabid hindu communalists. If you go by the amount of fear mongering in media you would have expected that most of the Muslims would have packed their bags and left for safer havens. Or at least they would try to conceal their identity. But no, you could easily identify them in their skull caps, sherwanis, beards, burkha etc.

约吉阿迪亚纳斯和莫迪被认为是最狂热的印度教社群主义者。如果你从媒体散布恐惧的数量来看,你会认为大多数穆斯林会收拾行李,去更安全的地方。或者至少他们会试图隐藏自己的身份。但是不,你可以很容易地从他们的头盖帽、雪瓦尼、胡须、长袍等中认出他们。

If india remained secular even after partition of India by Muslims demanding a separate country and ethnic cleansing of Hindus from pakistan, kashmir and bangladesh nothing can change the nature of Hindus.

如果印度保持世俗化,即使在印度被穆斯林要求一个独立的国家,并从巴基斯坦、克什米尔和孟加拉国对印度教徒进行种族清洗之后,也没有什么能改变印度教徒的本质。

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