话题讨论:为什么除了美国以外,其他国家没有把人送上月球?
2022-06-12 阿煌看什么 18815
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Eric Worrall , Director of Desirable Apps
Because nobody has the balls to do what must be done.
The Manhattan scientists developed a space drive in the 1950s, which would have allowed affordable exploration and colonisation of space. The most powerful version of the space drive could have powered a starship - sent a manned mission to Alpha Centauri, at 10% of the speed of light.
The space drive was briefly considered for the Apollo mission. But the space drive was nuclear. The old NAZI V2 scientist Wernher von Braun successfully campaigned against the nuclear option - so Apollo used spectacular, but utterly impractical chemical rockets, based on his old V2 systems.
I’ve sometimes wondered whether Von Braun’s vigorous defence of chemical rockets was his last gift to his Fuhrer. Because when he won the debate, not only did he stunt the space ambitions, he also ensured that the Jew Albert Einstein’s legacy to the world would be a terrible weapon, instead of a new space drive which could have opened our way to the stars.

【回答】
因为没有人有胆量去做必须做的事。
曼哈顿的科学家们在20世纪50年代开发了一种太空推进技术,这种技术本可以让人们负担得起探索和太空殖民的费用。最强大的太空推进器可以为一艘星际飞船提供动力——以10%的光速向半人马座阿尔法星发射载人飞船。
太空推进器曾被短暂地考虑用于阿波罗任务。 但是太空推进是核能的。 因此,阿波罗使用了壮观的、但是完全不切实际的化学火箭,这些火箭都是基于沃纳·冯·布劳恩的旧V2系统。
我有时想知道布劳恩对化学火箭的有力保护,是否是他送给他元首希特勒的最后礼物。因为当他赢得辩论时,他不仅阻碍了美国的太空野心,他还确保了犹太人阿尔伯特 · 爱因斯坦留给世界的遗产是一个可怕的武器,而不是一个新的太空推进器,它本可以开辟我们通往星辰的道路。

Richard J Breen
it was a race! USA "won" but at GREAT COST , in money and almost in lives.
Russia had fatal failures. It was just too expensive for them. the Soviets DID put up the first satellite ( in the process demonstrating that they could have an intercontinental missile which shocked America) Soviets also had the first animal, the first man and the first woman in space and the first exploration of Venus.

【回答】
那是场比赛! 美国“赢了” ,但付出了巨大的代价,无论是金钱还是生命。
俄罗斯有过致命的失败。这对他们来说代价太大了。苏联确实发射了第一颗人造卫星(在这个过程中,他们证明了他们可能拥有一枚震惊美国的洲际导弹)苏联也实现了第一次动物、第一次男人和第一次女人进入太空,还有第一次探索了金星。

Doug Schwan , studied at Alternative Medicine, Physics
Only two countries up to now had the resources for a manned mission to the moon.
The Russians did participate in the race but they were hampered by their inability to manufacture large bellows required for a heavy lift rocket engine. The bellows are the large nozzles where the rocket exhaust comes out.
To compensate, instead of 5 very large rocket engines like we used in the Apollo 1st stage, they built a rocket (The N1) which had 30 separate 1st stage engines!
The vibration and shock arising out of all these engines was too much for the designers to overcome and the rockets kept exploding on launch—-one creating the largest non-nuclear man made explosion ever recorded.
The Russians gave up after the U.S. was successful and no other country has the resources to come close to duplicating the feat.

【回答】
到目前为止,只有两个国家拥有载人登月的资源。
俄罗斯人确实参加了太空竞赛,但是他们无法生产大型波纹管,而这种波纹管是重型火箭发动机所必需的。波纹管是火箭废气排出的大型喷嘴。
为了弥补这一缺陷,他们制造了一个有30个独立的第一级发动机的火箭(N1) ,而不是我们在阿波罗1号上使用的5个非常大的火箭发动机!
所有这些发动机产生的振动和冲击太大,设计者无法克服,火箭在发射时经常爆炸——创造了有史以来最大的非核人为爆炸记录。
在美国成功之后,俄罗斯人放弃了,没有任何其他国家有能力复制这一壮举。

Balaji Viswanathan, Have been studying US history for a decade.
In the aftermath of the World War 2, only two powers got most of the key Nazi scientists - USA and USSR. US especially hit upon guys like Wernher von Braun - Hitler's brilliant rocket scientist who built the V-2 rockets that were later repurposed for the space program [Operation Paperclip and Operation Epsilon].
Just before that, in 1940, United States received a huge bonanza from UK, where the UK pretty much transferred all their key technological secrets to the US [How the Tizard Mission paved the way for research at MIT and Briefcase 'that changed the world'] making US the ultimate technological superpower. UK did this in a desperate bid to fight off the Nazis, by helping the Americans implement the technology for which UK desperately lacked the resources.
Just before that, US had a massive inflow of German Jews [such as Albert Einstein] fleeing the Nazis who again helped build a lot of scientific and technological foundations.
Of course, the US had plenty of great scientists even at the start of the 20th century. However, US had these three lucky events in just over a decade, that dramatically strengthened their sciences. In the post-war period, they were the only ones left with a great economy to capitalize on all that. USSR tried racing the US in space using the Nazis they captured [German legacy in the Soviet rocketry] and for a while they were the forerunner. However, their economy was not as big and their collaboration was not as global to continue the advantage.
The only other major economic power in that period was Japan and they didn't have the advantage of getting Nazi scientists nor they could invest a lot on rockets without raising suspicions of remilitarization. Countries like India, China and Brazil were too poor to invest heavily in expensive missions. They still got plenty of achievements though.
Again, US had the incentive to push to the moon. They were fighting a cold war with USSR and they had to show they were the superior. If the Russians had not launched Sputnik & other adventures, the Apollo mission might not have happened that soon. This is evident in how quickly NASA lost its funding priorities since the end of the cold war. Most of the rest of the world didn't have an equal incentive.
In the 21st century, China is heavily investing in space and India is following suit. China's Moon Missions Explained (Infographic) and India speeds up progress on its Moon mission. Now, there is a space race in Asia [It’s On: Asia’s New Space Race] as these economies finally got to a point where they can put more resources. Just like in the case of US-USSR, this is a race for domination and this incentive is providing a powerful push.
However, they still don't have the advantage of global collaboration like the US does [being the hub of the west - getting best of talent & tech from Europe, Australia, Canada etc]. It will take a long time for countries like China to catch up to NASA, but the gap grows shorter day by day.

【回答】我已经研究美国历史十年了。
在第二次世界大战之后,只有两个大国得到了大部分关键的纳粹科学家——美国和苏联。 美国人特别喜欢像沃纳·冯·布劳恩这样的人,他是希特勒杰出的火箭科学家,他制造了 V-2火箭,后来用于太空计划(回形针行动和艾普西隆行动)。
就在那之前,1940年,美国从英国获得了巨大的财源,英国几乎把他们所有的关键技术秘密转让给了美国,使美国成为终极的技术超级大国。英国这样做是为了孤注一掷地击退纳粹,帮助美国实施英国极度缺乏资源的技术。
就在那之前,大量德国犹太人(比如爱因斯坦)涌入美国,逃离纳粹,他们再次帮助美国建立了大量的科学和技术基础。
当然,即使在20世纪初,美国也有许多伟大的科学家。 然而,美国在短短十多年的时间里发生了三件幸运的事情,极大地加强了他们的科学。在战后时期,他们是唯一拥有强大经济的国家,可以利用这一切。苏联曾试图利用他们俘获的纳粹与美国在太空竞赛,有一段时间他们是先驱。然而,他们的经济规模没有那么大,他们的合作也没有那么全球化,无法继续保持这一优势。
那个时期唯一的另一个主要经济强国是日本,他们既没有得到纳粹科学家的优势,也不能在不引起重新军事化的怀疑的情况下大量投资火箭技术。在当时像印度、中国和巴西这样的国家太穷了,不能大量投资在昂贵的任务。尽管如此,他们仍然取得了许多成就。
再一次,美国有了登月的动机。他们与苏联进行冷战,他们必须表现出他们的优越性。如果俄国人没有发射人造卫星和其他的冒险活动,阿波罗任务可能就不会发生得这么快。自从冷战结束以来,美国航天局很快就失去了它的资金优先权,这一点很明显。世界上大多数其他国家并没有同样的动机。
在21世纪,中国在太空领域大举投资,印度也紧随其后。中国的月球任务和印度加速其月球任务的进展。现在,亚洲出现了一场太空竞赛,这些经济体投入更多资源用于太空任务。就像美苏的情况一样,这是一场统治权的竞赛,这种激励提供了强大的推动力。
然而,它们仍然没有美国那样的全球合作优势(作为西方的枢纽——从欧洲、澳大利亚、加拿大等国吸收最优秀的人才和技术)。像中国这样的国家要赶上NASA还需要很长时间,但是这种差距正一天天缩小。

Jerry Greelis
why other countries, including the U.S. has not gone (nor gone back) to the Moon; extremely expensive, both back then and still today. I worked the Apollo mission at JPL, we backed up the Manned Space Flight Network (MSFN) with the Deep Space Network (DSN), an additional mission cost for human safety with redundancy. We became critical for Apollo 13.
Mr. Hardwick stated why the mission was so expensive, one huge cost was getting the spacecraft up into space with a 36 story rocket. I live in Florida today and seen this monster at the Space Visitor Center, of course this being small compared to the SLS coming down the pike; costing a billion dollars.

【回答】
为什么其他国家,包括美国,再也没有登上月球的原因:非常昂贵,无论是当时还是现在。我曾在喷气推进实验室执行过阿波罗任务,我们用深空网络支持了载人航天飞行网络,这是一项为人的安全加上冗余性的额外任务成本。我们成为了阿波罗13号的关键人物。
哈德威克先生解释了为什么这次任务如此昂贵,一个巨大的成本是用一个36层的火箭将航天器送入太空。我今天住在佛罗里达州,在太空游客中心看到了这个怪物,当然,与即将到来的空间发射系统相比,这个怪物又显得微不足道,耗资10亿美元。

Mark Anthony , Internet Marketing, American Patriot, Business Professional
China and India already have a space program. They have all the technology needed to colonize the moon since we basically gave them everything we had in 2009. They just need to get up to speed with it and be able to understand what all they have.
But for America? Too expensive? Really?? You say that while typing on a keyboard made from a chemical that was perfected from space research. You are using the Internet that got a huge jump forward with the creation of the semi conductor that was perfected by technology created for the space program and the race to the moon.
We have learned almost all that we can from going to the moon. Going there now just to say you did it is not worth the effort or the cost. What is needed next (and Russia is working on it) is to go from the moon outward. That's where the exploration and the new discoveries that will change the world are waiting.
Most politicians now, are looking only at the next election, not at the future. Remember, it was President Kennedy that said He wanted America to go to the moon by the end of the DECADE, not the end of the election cycle. He saw the long term gains of space. He was in it for America and knew it would not be easy or fast but it would be beneficial to all.
If the International Space Station was a fixed base on the moon, its overall costs would be cut in half and we launch from there outward would be cheaper and more efficient in the long run. But expensive in the short term and would take international cooperation.

【回答】网络营销,美国爱国者,商业专家
中国和印度已经有了自己的太空计划。自从我们在2009年基本上给了他们所有的东西后,他们就拥有了殖民月球所需的一切技术。他们只需要跟上潮流,并且能够理解他们所拥有的一切。
但对美国来说呢? 太贵了? 真的吗?你说,当你在键盘上打字的时候,这个键盘是由一种从太空研究中得到完善的化学物质制成的。你正在使用的互联网,是随着太空计划和登月竞赛技术的发展,半导体的创造得到了巨大的飞跃。
我们从登月中几乎学到了我们所能学到的一切。现在去那里只是为了说你做到了,不值得付出努力或代价。接下来需要的(俄罗斯正在努力)是从月球向外探索。这就是那些将改变世界的探索和新发现正在等待的地方。
大多数政客现在只关注下一次选举,而不是未来。记住,是肯尼迪总统说过他希望在这个十年结束前美国能登上月球,而不是选举周期结束。他看到了空间的长期收益。他是为了美国而战,他知道这不是一件容易的事情,也不是一蹴而就的事情,但这对所有人都有好处。
如果国际空间站是月球上的一个固定基地,那么它的总成本将减少一半,从长远来看,我们从那里向外发射将更加便宜和高效。 但在短期内代价昂贵,需要国际合作。

Kévin Leroux
Why send someone who can die when you can send robots which are cheaper and more efficient ?
Of course sending a man on the moon is a technological breakthrough and a powerful show of science and technology for the country who did it.
However, it stop there, the soviets weren't going to send a man on the moon to be second it has no interest and they had huge problems with their rockets which was going worse because their main scientist Mr. korolev (the soviet equivalent of von Braun) died.
Today it's different, technology has massively improved as science. We now know that the moon is rich in resources which could be exploited and the moon could be used as a base to send men to other planets such as Mars.
Also the world had changed since 1969, the USSR collapsed and China became a new adversary to the US so we could get another space course.
For countries like China and India they need to get a good level of experience in this field, China has made big steps such as successfully land a robot on the dark side of the moon and India is doing similar program such as successfully sending probes even they are behind China actually.
I don't know if other countries could do this but it's likely that we see a man on the moon in the next 10-20 years.

【回答】
既然可以派出更便宜、更有效率的机器人,为什么还要派出会死的人呢?
当然,将人类送上月球是一项技术突破,也是这个国家强有力的科技展示。
然而,到此为止,苏联人并不打算把人送上月球成为第二个人,他们对此毫无兴趣,而且他们的火箭存在着巨大的问题,由于他们的主要科学家科罗廖夫先生(苏联版的凡 · 布劳恩)的死亡,火箭的情况正变得更糟。
今天不同了,科学技术有了很大的进步。我们现在知道,月球拥有丰富的资源,可以开发利用,月球可以作为基地,来把人送到其他星球,如火星。
自1969年以来,世界也发生了变化,苏联解体,中国成为美国的新对手,这样我们就可以开辟另一条太空航线。
对于像中国和印度这样的国家,他们需要在这个领域获得良好的经验,中国已经迈出了很大一步,比如成功地让机器人登上月球的远端,印度正在做类似的计划,比如成功地发射探测器,即使它们实际上已经落后于中国。
我不知道其他国家是否能做到这一点,但在未来的10-20年里,我们很可能会看到人类登上月球。
原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


Baiju Raju , works at 3d Studio Max
First of all.. it’s so expensive program. If human want to go moon it must be a 2 way trip. so that we want to carry a small rocket engine to moon to escape from there. And the moon don’t have atmosphere so we have to carry a descent rocket engine to land instead of a parachute; that both adding volume and consume lot of fuel to the trip. Consider all these things we have to build a huge rocket for this trip.
The thing is we can do a lot of similar experiments without actually human landing. and can avoid return trip back to Earth.
Now after finding Water on moon by ISRO’s Chandrayan . every nation is now focusing moon again. Now I think NASA, China, Japan India are trying to send humans to Moon.
Any way we can’t use the machine and technology of 1960’s. we have better technologies & better materials now. But again.. want to do lot of home works.

【回答】
首先...这个项目太贵了。如果人类想去月球,必须是一个双向的旅行。所以我们必须携带一个小型火箭发动机到月球,从那里脱离。而且月球没有大气层,所以我们必须携带一个下降的火箭发动机而不是降落伞着陆;这既增加了体积,又消耗了大量的燃料。考虑到所有这些事情,我们必须为这次旅行建造一个巨大的火箭。
问题是,我们可以做很多类似的实验,而不需要真正的人类着陆。可以避免返回地球的困难。
现在印度空间研究组织的钱德拉扬在月球上发现了水。 现在每个国家都在关注月球。 现在我认为美国宇航局,中国,日本,印度正在尝试将人类送上月球。
无论如何,我们不能使用60年代的机器和技术。我们现在有了更先进的技术和更好的材料。但是,再说一遍...要做更多的实验。

Uri Granta (אורי גרנטה) , not a werewolf
Why haven't countries other than the US gone to the moon?
If the question is about manned missions, then as the other answers note the main reason is cost-benefit. However, multiple countries have sent unmanned craft to the moon. The USSR was the first country to reach the moon (1959), photograph its far side (1959) and soft land there (1966). Japan (1990), Europe (2003), China (2007) and India (2008) have all sent moon orbiters, and China has also carried out a soft landing (2013) and is planning to return lunar samples in 2017.
First image from the surface of the moon, from the USSR's Luna 9 probe, Feb. 3-4, 1966. (Credit: Roscosmos)

【回答】
为什么除了美国以外的国家没有登上过月球?
如果问题是关于载人飞行任务,那么正如其他答案所指出的那样,主要原因是成本效益。 然而,许多国家已经向月球发射了无人驾驶飞船。 苏联是第一个登上月球的国家(1959年) ,拍摄了月球的背面(1959年)和软土地(1966年)。日本(1990年)、欧洲(2003年)、中国(2007年)和印度(2008年)都发射了月球探测器,中国还进行了软着陆(2013年) ,并在2017年返回月球样本。
1966年2月3日至4日,苏联“月球9号”探测器拍摄的第一张月球表面照片。

Manaal Johri , Student at La Martiniere College, Lucknow (2007-present)
Well originally space program was an enormous deal. The build-up of Apollo was highly against the backdrop of the highly charged cold war whose most visible or rather important mark was the space race between the USA and Soviet unx. But after the success of the Apollo missions, the enthusiasm significantly dropped. And people were even doubting that if NASA’s $209 Billion was even worth it. After this the Soviets were more inclined towards the making of a Space Station, and that's when Mir Space Station came into existence. After Mir they did not have much funds to uphold another Space program. And by the time they had some funds to do so the Soviet unx broke up on December 26, 1991. And for now USA and Russia together have decided to make a deep Space Station near the moon.
And as for now Indian Space Research Organization ISRO haven't told anything that if there are any space programs coming up.

【回答】勒克瑙拉马提尼埃学院学生(2007年至今)
起初,太空计划是一笔巨大的交易。阿波罗计划的建立是在高度紧张的冷战背景下进行的,冷战最明显或相当重要的标志是美国和苏联之间的太空竞赛。但在阿波罗任务成功之后,这种热情显著下降。人们甚至怀疑美国航天局的2090亿美元是否值得。在此之后,苏联更倾向于建立一个空间站,这就是和平号空间站成立的时候。在和平号空间站之后,他们没有太多的资金来支持另一个空间计划。当他们有足够资金的时候,苏联于1991年12月26日解体了。目前,美国和俄罗斯已经决定在月球附近建造一个深空站。
到目前为止,印度空间研究组织还没有透露是否有任何太空计划。

Jayan Cherian
The manned missions were taken up purely because of the cold war political scenario at that time. The project was not propelled by any scientific quest or for discovery. The russians beat the US at almost all the space missions. Kennedy came into office and promised catching up in the race by pumping in money to outdo the russians. Once the soviets imploded the need for such a race has gone. If the motivations are purely scientific it makes much more sense to send robots than send manned missions. Manned missions are purely for prestige. China has announced a manned mission. Until a political equivalent of cold war emerges again I don't see a prospect of pumping so much money for prestige driven missions.

【回答】
开展载人飞行任务完全是因为当时的冷战政治局势。 这个项目并没有受到任何科学探索或发现的推动。俄罗斯人在几乎所有的太空任务上都击败了美国。肯尼迪入主白宫,承诺通过投入资金赶超俄罗斯,之后在竞选中迎头赶上。一旦苏联解体了,这种竞赛的必要性就不复存在了。如果动机纯粹是科学性的,那么派遣机器人比派遣载人航天任务更有意义。载人航天任务纯粹是为了威望。中国已经宣布了载人航天任务。在政治上类似于冷战的局面再次出现之前,为声望而驱动的任务投入这么多资金,我看不到它的未来。

Damion Jones
The cost. Its mega expensive. ( Alrthough its cheaper than filling your car with petrol in the UK )
Russia didnt actually stop its efforts. It was a Race between the US and Russia and the US won. There was no need to really rush after that. Russia are still doing plenty with geting into space and they will be sending people to the moon soon, but the race was won and thats why they kind of backed off.
China and India already do have a space program. Have doen for a while. however, safety is so vital now, that they are not going to cut corners like the US did… They are goinmg to also use the mistakes that NASA made, to make sure that they dont happen again, plus of course, we have acces to better materials that are stronger and lighter
Its all good.

【回答】
成本超级昂贵。(尽管在英国这比给汽车加油还要便宜)
俄罗斯实际上并没有停止努力。这是一场美俄之间的竞赛,美国赢了。在那之后就没有必要真的这么匆忙了。俄罗斯仍然在进入太空方面做了大量的工作,他们很快就会把人送上月球,但竞赛中美国已经取得了胜利,这就是为什么他们有点退缩了。
中国和印度已经有了太空计划一段时间了。然而,安全非常重要,他们不会像美国那样走捷径... 他们也将利用美国宇航局犯下的错误,以确保他们不会再次发生危险,当然,我们现在有更好、更坚固和更轻的材料

Gwydion Madawc Williams
The Soviets did manage to get some moon-rock, but only after the US landing. There was a lot more to be learned from Mars and Venus, Mars especially. Lots of automatic probes have gone to the moon. NOthing very dramatic found. China has a flourishing space program and probably will send people to the moon, mainly to demonstrate that they are superior to everyone except the USA. India also has a program but is way behind, no astronauts yet. Japan has been unexpectedly bad at developing a space program.

【回答】
苏联人的确设法得到了一些月球岩石,但只是在美国登陆之后。从火星和金星,特别是火星,我们可以学到很多东西。许多自动探测器已经到达月球。并没有什么特别的发现。中国有着蒸蒸日上的太空计划,可能日后会把人送上月球,主要是为了证明他们比除了美国以外的任何人都优越。印度也有一个项目,但还远远落后,目前还没有宇航员。日本在发展太空计划方面的表现也出乎意料地糟糕。

Yesmer Tevac , studied at TU Delft Aerospace Engineering
The US thanked the Apollo missions for a great deal because of German rocket scientists that left Nazi Germany. Wernher von Braun for instance. Without Wernher it would have been a different story. When the space race began, Europe was still climbing out of the recession caused by WW2. The Russians put the first man in space and the first satellite. The moon mission would have been too expensive. The Americans wanted to be first and spent billions on the Apollo programs. A matter of choice.

【回答】2009年,在航空航天工业奖代尔夫特理工大学学习
美国感谢阿波罗计划,因为德国火箭科学家离开了纳粹德国。比如沃纳·冯·布劳恩。 如果没有布劳恩,情况就不一样了。当太空竞赛开始时,欧洲仍在爬出二战引起的经济衰退。俄国人把第一个人送上了太空,发射了第一颗卫星。 登月计划非常昂贵。 但美国人希望成为第一,并在阿波罗计划上花费了数十亿美元。这是一个选择的问题。

John Ohkuma Thiel , Amateur Astronomer and Space Geek
China has a space program completely independent of any other, and plans to land people on the Moon.
I'm cheering for China because it will cause my country to start being competitive again on every level.
Other countries, including India, have their own space programs, but not for human space flight. Their astronauts typically work with NASA.

【回答】业余天文爱好者和太空极客
中国有一个完全独立于其他国家的空间计划,并计划将人类送上月球。
我为中国欢呼,因为这将使我的国家在各个层面上重新开始具有竞争力。
包括印度在内的其他国家也有自己的太空计划,但没有载人航天计划。 他们的宇航员通常与美国宇航局合作。

原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处


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